What pisses you off?

[pietillidie]

[David]

[stui magpie]

Don't have a problem with irreverence or taking the P155.You can do both of those (and should, often) without being actually disrespectful.

You could take the P155 out of a bunch of turks and they'd likely join in with you. Wipe your arse with the turkish flag and it might be the last thing you ever do.

[David]

^ Yeah, but do you really want that kind of boneheaded nationalism here? I know I don't.

Irreverence by its very definition entails disrespect. Although they tend to be used in different contexts, they're practically synonymous. Violating sacred cows is irreverence of the best kind. I'd much prefer to live in a country where we can do that than one in which 'respect' is enforced by macho halfwits.

[Pies4shaw]

I'm sure I've said this before: I remember a time when people mostly didn't stand for the "national anthem" at the footy and recall the generalised cheers that went up at, eg, the 1977 second-semi final when Phabulous broke from the line-up and started running sprints to get himself warmed-up for the game. Now, people get very concerned - and sometimes aggressive - if you don't stand for the national anthem.

I always arrive just before the bounce on Anzac Day so that I don't have to suffer through the pre-game nonsense. I was brought up wrong, you see - my father fought against the Japanese in New Guinea and his view was (and remains, even in his dotage) that he did so in the hope that his children wouldn't have to stand for - or doff their cap to - authority. The paradox, of course, is that on Anzac Day I am unable to express my respect for my father's efforts in WWII in the only way he would find acceptable (that is, by remaining seated - and preferably chatting - during the "national anthem") for fear of being heckled by people who consider such behaviour unacceptable.

[HAL]

Well it seems like your parents did a good job.

[think positive]

i remember being at the Melbourne show with my dad and my older sister. we were leaving after the fireworks and the national anthem came on. I stopped, my dad stopped, my sister kept walking. my dad screamed "stand still you ignorant git, your not a bloody aussie yet!"

and I concur! not often I agree with my dad, but I do. it may be your right to ignore such "frivilties, and you may think your standing up for your beliefs by doing so, but those soldiers that have come back from war, and the relatives of those who didn't, they will judge you as something else. and their feelings mean a lot more than your pathetic little protest.

both my parents were in the airforce in Germany. my grandfather was a bomb disposal expert.

don't sit in front of me on Anzac day, cos youll hear me loud and clear

stand on your feet you ignorant, disrespectful, unappreciative, arrogant, selfish, git.

[Pies4shaw]

Rubbish, tp - my father fought in the war. And he very definitely doesn't want me to stand up. His considered view is that only "ignorant, disrespectful, unappreciative, arrogant, selfish, gits" stand.

[think positive]

[Pies4shaw]

I just used the expression that I understood you to be directing at me, tp. There is a dilemma here, you see. Not everyone thinks it's a sign of respect to stand. Some people think that do so actively trashes the memory of the people who fought. Not everyone who fights in a war joins the RSL upon return.

[think positive]

I was directing it at anyone who sits and I can see em!

as for the rest, that's ridiculous, how could it possibly be seen as a sign of disrespect?

[David]

[1061]

Oh aren't you sweet suggesting TP is less than 40 years old.

[HAL]

Take it easy. Are they exactly the same?

[pietillidie]

Most of those who crap on about flags and national anthems have had very little experience with the menace of nationalism. Go live in Northeast Asia for a while when Japan, South Korea and China are burning each other's brands and embassies and you'll soon learn to hate the bloody things.

Watching Americans and Brits wank on about the glories of empire is vulgar enough even when you're not the target of their ignorant jingoism. Just imagine how everyone else feels.

Pretending anything represents some transcendent greatness is a fast track to idolatrous, brain dead misery, and the quickest way to turn otherwise sane individuals into drooling mobs of Neanderthals.

When you're in the extreme minority you very, very quickly learn to dread and hate displays of nationalism of any kind. It then only takes about two neuronal connections to work out that if you hate such displays, then your zombie national symbols are likely to be making others feel exactly the same way.

And, as they say, do unto others....