IRAQ
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joffa corfe
PREMIERS 2010
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
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| Collingpie wrote: | At the risk of going out on a limb, I'm fully supportive of why we are in Iraq. It's just as necessary as any other war, just different. We are fighting a non-conventional enemy though. An enemy that wants to destroy everything we stand for, even this very site. They do not have a nation, or an organised army or an elected government. The common thread is their God. Any brief study of their religion will show that theirs is not the most friendly God you could pick.
Of course the downside to all the focus being on Iraq is that it takes the focus off Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Chechnya, The Phillipines, Nigeria, Venezuela, Afghanistan, Palestine, Malaysia, Indonesia etc etc.
The war did not end four years ago. It probably started before our grandparents were born. It'll probably still be going when our unborn grandchildren are old enough to vote.
Who doesn't value their life ? But if it comes down to them or us well, I know what side I'll be on. And if it means a few nukes are let loose again, then so be it. If it means that my unborn grandchildren can live in the same sort of security that we have enjoyed thus far then it's better than them never being born at all. |
Welcome collingpie!
So your answer is to let of a few nukes ?
For the sole purpose of destroying the arab nations ? that equals genocide.
Actually... generally speaking they are friendly people no God preaches war and mayhem, with exception to the extremists who shall we say are a little unbalanced..let me put it this way if the whole arab world as one practised the jihad doctrine none of us would be here now. I dont want my Grandchildren growing up in a world dominated and dictated by the western world, i dont want them to see other nations because of color and religeon simply nuked away because beliefs and philosphies differ to ours.
The answer here is not to invade other countries but to come together and talk through our problems, scratch a few backs pat a few backsides, the power of sincere dialogue is the answer...the coalition stormed Iraq on the pretence of locating weapons of mass destruction they were never found, the presence of America and the coalition is not succeeding and one wonders maybe the only answer is for America and the coalition to pack up and go home.
What a shocking waste of human life, war is futile and useless and never produces a victor , its nothing but misery sadness and a bad reflection on mankind...its nothing more than the bullies syndrome.
And one cant help but feel for the children of Iraq who have lost families and left orphaned..no child should ever witness the atrocities of war!!!
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Football is Greatness
http://youtu.be/tJwoKbPOsQE |
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Collingpie
Joined: 28 Jan 2007
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| joffa corfe wrote: | | Collingpie wrote: | At the risk of going out on a limb, I'm fully supportive of why we are in Iraq. It's just as necessary as any other war, just different. We are fighting a non-conventional enemy though. An enemy that wants to destroy everything we stand for, even this very site. They do not have a nation, or an organised army or an elected government. The common thread is their God. Any brief study of their religion will show that theirs is not the most friendly God you could pick.
Of course the downside to all the focus being on Iraq is that it takes the focus off Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Chechnya, The Phillipines, Nigeria, Venezuela, Afghanistan, Palestine, Malaysia, Indonesia etc etc.
The war did not end four years ago. It probably started before our grandparents were born. It'll probably still be going when our unborn grandchildren are old enough to vote.
Who doesn't value their life ? But if it comes down to them or us well, I know what side I'll be on. And if it means a few nukes are let loose again, then so be it. If it means that my unborn grandchildren can live in the same sort of security that we have enjoyed thus far then it's better than them never being born at all.
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1)Welcome collingpie!
2)So your answer is to let of a few nukes ?
3)For the sole purpose of destroying the arab nations ? that equals genocide.
4)Actually... generally speaking they are friendly people no God preaches war and mayhem, with exception to the extremists who shall we say are a little unbalanced..let me put it this way if the whole arab world as one practised the jihad doctrine none of us would be here now.
5)I dont want my Grandchildren growing up in a world dominated and dictated by the western world, i dont want them to see other nations because of color and religeon simply nuked away because beliefs and philosphies differ to ours.
6)The answer here is not to invade other countries but to come together and talk through our problems, scratch a few backs pat a few backsides, the power of sincere dialogue is the answer...
7)the coalition stormed Iraq on the pretence of locating weapons of mass destruction they were never found, the presence of America and the coalition is not succeeding and one wonders maybe the only answer is for America and the coalition to pack up and go home.
8)What a shocking waste of human life, war is futile and useless and never produces a victor , its nothing but misery sadness and a bad reflection on mankind...its nothing more than the bullies syndrome.
9)And one cant help but feel for the children of Iraq who have lost families and left orphaned..no child should ever witness the atrocities of war!!! |
I've broken down your reply Joffa and reply thus:
1) Cheers, here's to a flag in 2007
2) If needs be and only as a last resort in order to save many more lives than would otherwise be lost - it has happened before
3) Genocide is a racial thing, not a national thing
4) Joffa, read the Koran and get back to me on this one
5) As a grandchild of my grandparents, I grew up in a world completely dominated and dictated by the western world. Didn't you ?
6) Leftish wishful thinking at it's best Joffa
7) Surely you still don't believe this ? A good media spin though
 Rubbish. If it was so bloody futile, why do humn beings continue to fight wars ? We've been in competition for resources since we first learned we could kill one another for said resources. Six billion monkeys is what we are. Vietnam won the Vietnam War, the Allies (including Australia) won the second world war and the first world war et al There's an old saying "If you want to secure peace, prepare for war"
9) I agree, so, for example, what's a 10 year old palestinian kid doing toting an AK47 in "training" for ?
In the immortal words of Thomas Paine: "If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, so that my children may have peace" |
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lambs brains for tea 
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: butcher's cool room
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Does anyone remember a couple of towers that use to be in New York?
Or is that ok with some as it was only" Americans"?
When the towers were hit, the rules of war were changed forever!
I find it amazing how some people can adopt American culutre,(The rap version of our club song for example.) Yet take cheap shots every chance they can at the country they stopped our national language becoming japanese. |
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Brewer's Droop 
HIC
Joined: 22 Jan 2007
Location: Greater Albania
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Read your history. We stopped the Japanese advance in New Guinea.
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The wheels on the bus go round and round, but still they are not as round as Perry |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Sorry I don't have access to that document. |
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lambs brains for tea
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: butcher's cool room
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| Brewer's Droop wrote: | | Read your history. We stopped the Japanese advance in New Guinea. |
Perhaps you should read your books a little bit more yourself.
The japanese were originally going to launch an assault on Port Morseby by sea. This was stopped by a couple of ships and a few planes that carried the American flag. It was known as the battle of Midway.
You may also might have heard of the pacific campaign. I believe the japanese were forced back to japan by the Americans one island at a time and suffered huge losses of American lives. There were also Americans fighting in New Guinea. |
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London Dave 
Ješte jedna pivo prosím
Joined: 16 Dec 1998
Location: Iceland on Thames
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| lambs brains for tea wrote: | | Brewer's Droop wrote: | | Read your history. We stopped the Japanese advance in New Guinea. |
Perhaps you should read your books a little bit more yourself.
The japanese were originally going to launch an assault on Port Morseby by sea. This was stopped by a couple of ships and a few planes that carried the American flag. It was known as the battle of Midway.
You may also might have heard of the pacific campaign. I believe the japanese were forced back to japan by the Americans one island at a time and suffered huge losses of American lives. There were also Americans fighting in New Guinea. |
actually, the Australians stopped the Japanese at Milne Bay, and subsequently in the highlands iirc, though the crucial part in turning back/halting the Japanese in New Guinea was the US victory in the naval battle of the Coral Sea. no US Navy victory in the Coral Sea, no Australian 'victory' in PNG. |
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joffa corfe
PREMIERS 2010
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
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| Collingpie wrote: | | joffa corfe wrote: | | Collingpie wrote: | At the risk of going out on a limb, I'm fully supportive of why we are in Iraq. It's just as necessary as any other war, just different. We are fighting a non-conventional enemy though. An enemy that wants to destroy everything we stand for, even this very site. They do not have a nation, or an organised army or an elected government. The common thread is their God. Any brief study of their religion will show that theirs is not the most friendly God you could pick.
Of course the downside to all the focus being on Iraq is that it takes the focus off Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabia, Chechnya, The Phillipines, Nigeria, Venezuela, Afghanistan, Palestine, Malaysia, Indonesia etc etc.
The war did not end four years ago. It probably started before our grandparents were born. It'll probably still be going when our unborn grandchildren are old enough to vote.
Who doesn't value their life ? But if it comes down to them or us well, I know what side I'll be on. And if it means a few nukes are let loose again, then so be it. If it means that my unborn grandchildren can live in the same sort of security that we have enjoyed thus far then it's better than them never being born at all.
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1)Welcome collingpie!
2)So your answer is to let of a few nukes ?
3)For the sole purpose of destroying the arab nations ? that equals genocide.
4)Actually... generally speaking they are friendly people no God preaches war and mayhem, with exception to the extremists who shall we say are a little unbalanced..let me put it this way if the whole arab world as one practised the jihad doctrine none of us would be here now.
5)I dont want my Grandchildren growing up in a world dominated and dictated by the western world, i dont want them to see other nations because of color and religeon simply nuked away because beliefs and philosphies differ to ours.
6)The answer here is not to invade other countries but to come together and talk through our problems, scratch a few backs pat a few backsides, the power of sincere dialogue is the answer...
7)the coalition stormed Iraq on the pretence of locating weapons of mass destruction they were never found, the presence of America and the coalition is not succeeding and one wonders maybe the only answer is for America and the coalition to pack up and go home.
8)What a shocking waste of human life, war is futile and useless and never produces a victor , its nothing but misery sadness and a bad reflection on mankind...its nothing more than the bullies syndrome.
9)And one cant help but feel for the children of Iraq who have lost families and left orphaned..no child should ever witness the atrocities of war!!! |
I've broken down your reply Joffa and reply thus:
1) Cheers, here's to a flag in 2007
2) If needs be and only as a last resort in order to save many more lives than would otherwise be lost - it has happened before
3) Genocide is a racial thing, not a national thing
4) Joffa, read the Koran and get back to me on this one
5) As a grandchild of my grandparents, I grew up in a world completely dominated and dictated by the western world. Didn't you ?
6) Leftish wishful thinking at it's best Joffa
7) Surely you still don't believe this ? A good media spin though
Rubbish. If it was so bloody futile, why do humn beings continue to fight wars ? We've been in competition for resources since we first learned we could kill one another for said resources. Six billion monkeys is what we are. Vietnam won the Vietnam War, the Allies (including Australia) won the second world war and the first world war et al There's an old saying "If you want to secure peace, prepare for war"
9) I agree, so, for example, what's a 10 year old palestinian kid doing toting an AK47 in "training" for ?
In the immortal words of Thomas Paine: "If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, so that my children may have peace" |
Well thanks Collingpie look forward in having a coffee with you after our 2007 flag 
Well i have read the Koran its a marvellous read.
No weapons of mass destruction were ever found if that means Iraq moved them into Syria or Iran before they could be located who knows.
I see invaders of another country as the agrressor, please dont give me the Kuwait spin as it was in Americas interest to go and protect Kuwait.
I dont understand your response to the ' futile ' claim, so your saying that wars are not futile simply because we have wars...
I dont see any logic with your ten year old palestinian child with an AK47 has to do with my claim no child should ever witness the atrocity of war, every night i listen to the BBC world news i find it gut wrenching to hear a child cry over the body of her blown up mother or some child laying in an Iraq hospital with no legs and no eye sight.
Nice chatting to ya collingpie 
from joffa lefty...LOL
cheers mate
_________________
Football is Greatness
http://youtu.be/tJwoKbPOsQE |
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joffa corfe
PREMIERS 2010
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
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| lambs brains for tea wrote: | Does anyone remember a couple of towers that use to be in New York?
Or is that ok with some as it was only" Americans"?
When the towers were hit, the rules of war were changed forever!
I find it amazing how some people can adopt American culutre,(The rap version of our club song for example.) Yet take cheap shots every chance they can at the country they stopped our national language becoming japanese. |
We should never forget the tragedy of the twin towers but let me pose another question how many innocent Iraqi citizens have been killed since the invasion of the coalition ?
_________________
Football is Greatness
http://youtu.be/tJwoKbPOsQE |
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lambs brains for tea
Joined: 29 Sep 2005
Location: butcher's cool room
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| joffa corfe wrote: | | lambs brains for tea wrote: | Does anyone remember a couple of towers that use to be in New York?
Or is that ok with some as it was only" Americans"?
When the towers were hit, the rules of war were changed forever!
I find it amazing how some people can adopt American culutre,(The rap version of our club song for example.) Yet take cheap shots every chance they can at the country they stopped our national language becoming japanese. |
We should never forget the tragedy of the twin towers but let me pose another question how many innocent Iraqi citizens have been killed since the invasion of the coalition ? |
How many innocent Iraqi's were killed under the rule of saddam? |
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| joffa corfe wrote: | | I see invaders of another country as the agrressor, please dont give me the Kuwait spin as it was in Americas interest to go and protect Kuwait. |
Still, does this mean it was wrong for them to do so?
| joffa corfe wrote: | | every night i listen to the BBC world news i find it gut wrenching to hear a child cry over the body of her blown up mother or some child laying in an Iraq hospital with no legs and no eye sight. |
Now, correct me if I'm wrong here. Since the original attacks, hasn't most of the carnage been the responsibility of the so-called 'insurgents'?
If this is the case, then basically what people are saying is that the Americans should leave so that Iraqis will stop killing Iraqis.
If anything, I would see that as a big reason for America and Australia to stay in Iraq. Sure, Saddam is gone, but there are plenty of would-be Saddams out there... if our forces left, and his supporters were to regain control of the country (which, presumably, is their aim), then Iraq would be no better than when it was before the beginning of the war.
Thoughts?
_________________
All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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joffa corfe
PREMIERS 2010
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
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| David wrote: | | joffa corfe wrote: | | I see invaders of another country as the agrressor, please dont give me the Kuwait spin as it was in Americas interest to go and protect Kuwait. |
Still, does this mean it was wrong for them to do so?
| joffa corfe wrote: | | every night i listen to the BBC world news i find it gut wrenching to hear a child cry over the body of her blown up mother or some child laying in an Iraq hospital with no legs and no eye sight. |
Now, correct me if I'm wrong here. Since the original attacks, hasn't most of the carnage been the responsibility of the so-called 'insurgents'?
If this is the case, then basically what people are saying is that the Americans should leave so that Iraqis will stop killing Iraqis.
If anything, I would see that as a big reason for America and Australia to stay in Iraq. Sure, Saddam is gone, but there are plenty of would-be Saddams out there... if our forces left, and his supporters were to regain control of the country (which, presumably, is their aim), then Iraq would be no better than when it was before the beginning of the war.
Thoughts? |
Exactly David your spot on mate there are plenty of Saddams out there infact world over!
The insurgence i gather is most probably directed at the coalitions presence in Iraq with the other violence basically being sectarian driven, let me put it this way if anything the withdrawal of all coalition troops from Iraq might just have the opposite effect and reduce the ammount of violence i mean how would we know until it happens...no ones going to win this one its just one huge frightening mess.
Is Iraq better of now than what it was before the war ? ...come back to me with the loss of Iraqi woman and children and we'll discuss it further, war is nothing but legalised murder!!
cheerio
_________________
Football is Greatness
http://youtu.be/tJwoKbPOsQE |
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joffa corfe
PREMIERS 2010
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
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The fact is David we're both guilty of being hypocrites because you have stated you wouldnt pick up arms and go to war even if it meant an invasion of our homeland but in this case you seem to be advocating the coailitions right to invade and murder, myself i dont like war and totally opposed to it but then again if our homeland was under invasion i'd certainly pick up arms to protect it
_________________
Football is Greatness
http://youtu.be/tJwoKbPOsQE |
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joffa corfe
PREMIERS 2010
Joined: 13 Nov 2003
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| lambs brains for tea wrote: | | joffa corfe wrote: | | lambs brains for tea wrote: | Does anyone remember a couple of towers that use to be in New York?
Or is that ok with some as it was only" Americans"?
When the towers were hit, the rules of war were changed forever!
I find it amazing how some people can adopt American culutre,(The rap version of our club song for example.) Yet take cheap shots every chance they can at the country they stopped our national language becoming japanese. |
We should never forget the tragedy of the twin towers but let me pose another question how many innocent Iraqi citizens have been killed since the invasion of the coalition ? |
How many innocent Iraqi's were killed under the rule of saddam? |
Good question however i'll answer it with another question how many people have been murdered raped butchered in Sudan ?
Why isnt the coalition in sudan to stop the Genocide ?
_________________
Football is Greatness
http://youtu.be/tJwoKbPOsQE |
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pezza
Joined: 13 Jun 2005
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| joffa corfe wrote: | | lambs brains for tea wrote: | | joffa corfe wrote: | | lambs brains for tea wrote: | Does anyone remember a couple of towers that use to be in New York?
Or is that ok with some as it was only" Americans"?
When the towers were hit, the rules of war were changed forever!
I find it amazing how some people can adopt American culutre,(The rap version of our club song for example.) Yet take cheap shots every chance they can at the country they stopped our national language becoming japanese. |
We should never forget the tragedy of the twin towers but let me pose another question how many innocent Iraqi citizens have been killed since the invasion of the coalition ? |
How many innocent Iraqi's were killed under the rule of saddam? |
Good question however i'll answer it with another question how many people have been murdered raped butchered in Sudan ?
Why isnt the coalition in sudan to stop the Genocide ? |
Thats an excellent question Joff. This is something the United Nations should be hotly pursuing. Unfortunately the UN is a toothless tiger. |
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