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member34258
Joined: 05 Nov 2006
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I fully support the actions of these parents.
No-one can imagine the pain they must have gone through to take these actions. |
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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Well, the only person who is of importance here is of course the child... so if the consensus is that this will make her quality of life better, it makes sense to go ahead with it.
_________________
All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| member34258 wrote: | I fully support the actions of these parents.
No-one can imagine the pain they must have gone through to take these actions. |
Or what? |
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eddies bank balance
evolving-unlimited-intellect
Joined: 27 May 2004
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| David wrote: | | Well, the only person who is of importance here is of course the child... so if the consensus is that this will make her quality of life better, it makes sense to go ahead with it. |
Why not just kill the child? You people have already taken away the childs [free will]!
Deep down, the parents and you people above ^ have chosen what's best for you!
Tess, it's better for you to have lived and known what choice you have in life, rather than someone (a parent) making that choice for you.
_________________
free energy i$ coming.... |
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Proud Pies 
Joined: 22 Feb 2003
Location: Knox-ish
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| eddies bank balance wrote: | | David wrote: | | Well, the only person who is of importance here is of course the child... so if the consensus is that this will make her quality of life better, it makes sense to go ahead with it. |
Why not just kill the child? You people have already taken away the childs [free will]!
Deep down, the parents and you people above ^ have chosen what's best for you!
Tess, it's better for you to have lived and known what choice you have in life, rather than someone (a parent) making that choice for you. |
I'm not advocating what the parent's have done, nor am i against it. I just don't know what I'd do in the same situation.
I read the article, this child doesn't know free will. She is stuck in the mental age of a 3 month old baby. What's best for this child? to be stuck in that age with the body of a teenager? menstruating? going through the pain of menstruation? getting breasts, going through the pain of menopause?
I don't know what's right for this child. I think the parents, having considering all options, are doing what they believe is the right thing with all the knowledge that they have gleaned.
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Jacqui © Proud Pies 2003 and beyond |
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eddies bank balance
evolving-unlimited-intellect
Joined: 27 May 2004
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| Tess wrote: | | eddies bank balance wrote: |
Tess, it's better for you to have lived and known what choice you have in life, rather than someone (a parent) making that choice for you. |
In my friends case, her daughter is as advanced as she will ever be. This little darling is in Respite care 3 - 4 days a month to give her parents a break. |
So Tess, are you saying that we should "blame the parents" for producing a child of "imperfection" ?
..or should the parents have adopted the imperfect child out..? (unconditional love?)
| Tess wrote: | | Looking into a darker future whats to say someone doesn't take advantage of her and get her pregnant. |
It's all about choice, stranger things have happened.
| Tess wrote: | | A 5yo cannot take care of a baby. Or if she goes through puberty how will a girl of 5 who screams if she even see's blood in "cooked" meat deal with a bloody period? |
...I'm sure there is an answer to that.
| Tess wrote: | | This girl will be 5yo forever, so let her be 5 forever don't force adulthood on her. |
...but you don't mind to force 'childhood' upon her? Then would you like remain male-gender for your entire life, just to save you the burden of "life's changes". Hmm, But you wouldn't because you atleast have a choice, whether you be 5 or 45.
_________________
free energy i$ coming.... |
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eddies bank balance
evolving-unlimited-intellect
Joined: 27 May 2004
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| Proud Pies wrote: | | I don't know what's right for this child. |
You are a parent, could you do the same?
| Proud Pies wrote: | | I think the parents, having considering all options, |
What is the alternative? I say, to let child develop and the parents deal with all consequences, or GIVE the child away.
| Proud Pies wrote: | | I think the parents, having considering all options, are doing what they believe is the right thing with all the knowledge that they have gleaned. |
They are doing what they think is right for themselves.
_________________
free energy i$ coming.... |
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Proud Pies
Joined: 22 Feb 2003
Location: Knox-ish
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| eddies bank balance wrote: | | Proud Pies wrote: | | I don't know what's right for this child. |
You are a parent, could you do the same? |
yes, i am a parent. could i do the same? I don't know. My child is now 24, when she was born, they didn't have the knowledge they do now.
| eddies bank balance wrote: | | Proud Pies wrote: | | I think the parents, having considering all options, |
What is the alternative? I say, to let child develop and the parents deal with all consequences, or GIVE the child away. |
As I said, i don't know what the alternatives are.
| eddies bank balance wrote: | | Proud Pies wrote: | | I think the parents, having considering all options, are doing what they believe is the right thing with all the knowledge that they have gleaned. |
They are doing what they think is right for themselves. |
possibly, but until we are in their shoes, we will never know.
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Jacqui © Proud Pies 2003 and beyond |
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pica
Joined: 09 Aug 2004
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Ashley's dad's reasons for the decision he and his wife have made...in consultation with specialists who, incidentally, fully agree with them... are quite compelling. Well thought out and logical. Selfish? I don't think so but I'd rather never have to make such a decision.
Sorry if any of the above has already been said, but the instigator of this thread is on my ignore list. |
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punkologist 
Barwick goals, the pies are home!
Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Location: Level 2 Ponsford Stand
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My uncle Brian was involved in a serious road accident in WA when he was a child where he was hit by a truck while crossing the road and is now in a wheelchair. The doctors say he has the mind of a six year old even though he is now over 40. I would support anything that would improve the quality of his life. He is a great person and I love him very much.
We all look after him, he has a pies membership and he has his spot in the Ponny, we take turns in looking after him each game. (taking him to the toilet, getting him food etc).
I have a real understanding for people with mental and physical diabilities and anything that can help them can only be good.
You probably would have seen him if you sit in the ponny he sits just near the main entrance from the social club bar, if you do say hi to him, Collingwood is a big part in what keeps him going, it would make his day! |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| eddies bank balance wrote: | | David wrote: | | Well, the only person who is of importance here is of course the child... so if the consensus is that this will make her quality of life better, it makes sense to go ahead with it. |
Why not just kill the child? You people have already taken away the childs [free will]!
Deep down, the parents and you people above ^ have chosen what's best for you!
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The child has no [free will]! Or if she does, it's not much. Can she make such a decision for herself? Apparently not.
Yes, it's a complex ethical issue. However, those who know what they are talking about, and the parents (who undoubtedly love the child) both agree that this is the best thing for her.
Whether or not it makes me or you comfortable is irrelevant. Your assertion seems to be based on nothing more than cynicism.
In the personal realm, free will is but a method of achieving 'happiness'. If free will circumvents that aim, does that not render it irrelevant?
In other words, would you give her so-called 'free will' at the expense of her quality of life? Who exactly are you assisting then?
_________________
All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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eddies bank balance
evolving-unlimited-intellect
Joined: 27 May 2004
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| David wrote: |
Whether or not it makes me or you comfortable is irrelevant. Your assertion seems to be based on nothing more than cynicism. |
For six yrs I managed an agency that provided personal care for the "aged & disabled", so it's not cynicism.
Spend some time with a child or adult who are mentally "challenged", you may like them the way they have grown, naturally.
Remember, we used to hide mongoloids from the public, suppress their thought/s and train them - to weave baskets. The mongoloids are now known as suffer'ers of Down Syndrome. They're the kindest and most loving people I've ever met.
| David wrote: | | In the personal realm, free will is but a method of achieving 'happiness'. If free will circumvents that aim, does that not render it irrelevant? |
Free will = individual choice/thought, happiness is not guaranteed.
| David wrote: | | In other words, would you give her so-called 'free will' at the expense of her quality of life? Who exactly are you assisting then? |
The world isn't perfect outside of Canberra, or haven't you noticed. 
_________________
free energy i$ coming.... |
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David
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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| eddies bank balance wrote: | | Spend some time with a child or adult who are mentally "challenged", you may like them the way they have grown, naturally. |
Who cares if I like them or not? How completely irrelevant.
| eddies bank balance wrote: | | Remember, we used to hide mongoloids from the public, suppress their thought/s and train them - to weave baskets. The mongoloids are now known as suffer'ers of Down Syndrome. They're the kindest and most loving people I've ever met. |
So, if there was a 'cure' for down syndrome, would you support its application? Interesting question isn't it.
| eddies bank balance wrote: | | David wrote: | | In other words, would you give her so-called 'free will' at the expense of her quality of life? Who exactly are you assisting then? |
The world isn't perfect outside of Canberra, or haven't you noticed. |
Have you ever been to Canberra, EBB? A year ago two of the people I work with at McDonald's (one of them a 19 year old girl) got bashed with metal bars after finishing a shift one night. The little street I live on has had many visits from police cars over the years (it's not a particularly nice neighbourhood). I myself have been threatened with physical violence by a random while walking back from the shops late at night. Apart from that, your dig has nothing whatsoever to do with the discussion anyway. Even if I lived in an amish village, what does that have to do with the question of free will?
_________________
All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Didaicos
The Macedonian Marvel = The Croat Confoundment!!!
Joined: 06 Jun 2006
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I had a brain damaged cousin in a very similar situation (she died aged 5).
Look, I agree with what the parents have done. I can't imagine the difficulties that would have faced my cousin had she lived into her pubecent years or longer.
But these issues are faced with ethical issues that have NO black and white solutions. Each one must be faced with an open mind with respect; and until people have been in the situation they should be careful with what they say or denigrate people's choices.
That same philosphy needs to be applied to many of the other issues of today. Instead I feel people get too emotional and refuse to see the other person's view.
The obvious one is abortion (But please let's not start a flame war).
_________________
WELLLINGHAM ROVES IT....AND KICKS THE GOAL!!!!
SWAN'S GOING TO KICK A GOAL. THEY'RE HOME YOU'D THINK I KNOW IT'S A LONG WAY TO GO BUT THEY'RE KILLING THEM NOW!! |
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eddies bank balance
evolving-unlimited-intellect
Joined: 27 May 2004
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| David wrote: | | Who cares if I like them or not? How completely irrelevant. |
I'm concerned with the situation, maybe you're not.
| David wrote: | | So, if there was a 'cure' for down syndrome, would you support its application? Interesting question isn't it. |
Currently, the only "cure" for Down Syndrome, is abortion. So NO, the question is not interesting. The first step would-be, to isolate the cause of Down Syndrome..
| David wrote: |
Have you ever been to Canberra, EBB? |
Yep, 3 times.
_________________
free energy i$ coming.... |
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