The draw

[MarkT]

Ed & Fradam, you are right. Unfortunately we aint here yet. We despirately need finals action for the club, the sponsors, player development, AFL coffers and the supporters.

JLC, ladder position has nothing to do with it. If it did I could accept it. During the season all clubs submit a wish list. Most put 2 Collingwood games at the top of their list. I presume we don't put "can we have the hardest draw please" on our list so presumably we two thirds of Jack Sh** of what we ask for. It is true we want to play Essendon & Carlton twice. All the clubs want us to as well because they get $$ out of it.

If we played WCE or St.Kilda twice instead of Richmond or Hawthorn we would still be in line for a finals berth. That is the difference.

If these teams have contracts to play us twice, the AFL has contracted with our collective opposition to make it more difficult for us to play finals. Whether it is deliberate or not, the effect is the same.

Sorry to harp on about it but I sit here pondering another boring September, frightened that Essendon or Carlton will win the flag, and I am NOT HAPPY JAN!!!!!

[Rohan Coventry Tateson]

It would be interesting to hear what McGuire thinks about it?

In Skob We Trust

[Black_White]

How come no-one asked about the other power teams and what they request in the draw?
The answer is simple, they want the same thing as CFC! They want to play CFC twice every year. Reason....MONEY ! !
The other teams (Essenscum, Carlscum) both have what we want. Money and the respect of the other teams. This is what we are working towards. Tough draws are just a by product of the process.
Can I please remind you that a few short years ago CFC was technically bankrupt. We need to consolidate the hard work that has been done to make us financially sound. Then , and only then , can we become once again the power of the competition. A club to be feared off and on the field.
I would love a premiership now, but I can see that we still have a wait on our hands. Short term glory is not what I crave. I crave people to look at me in my Collingwood colours and fear and loath me. Like the good old days.
Blockbusters are the way to go in terms of revenue streams. We just have to improve our on field performance and then you'll be screaming for these matches.
We are close, be patient.

-Craig

FAITH

[MarkT]

Craig, I remember the good old days too.
You are right and I agree that our rise must be sustainable. Our your means we can sustain a rise. Look at the help handed out to some of the clubs - financial, scheduling, draft handouts (Freemantl's extra draft pick because Melbourne were over the salary cap when they drafted White ahead of 14 other clubs must go down as the most transparent act of favoratism ever). All we ask is a fair, even random, draw.

[JLC]

Ladder position does affect the draw as when the AFL does their cuttoff point which is about round 20 you play four teams currently in the top 8 at that time twice and four teams in the bottom eight at that time.

Ask Eddie to explain how they do the draw

APA

EVERYONE IS A COLLINGWOOD SUPPORTER ITS JUST THAT SOME PEOPLE ARE IN DENIAL

[Rohan Coventry Tateson]

It is well known we have the hardest draw in the AFL. It’s a bravo attitude by McGuire and co to demand games against the toughest teams in the AFL, but it is stupid.

We have suffered greatly recently. No finals and another September watching our most hated foes battle it for the flag is another bitter pill to shallow.

Now is the time to make our task ahead easier, not harder. I am not suggesting we drop the blockbuster games (Carlton, Essendon) but we achieve a balance in the draw that sees us playing these two foes, but also playing weaker teams such as St Kilda, Fremantle and West Coast twice in the same season.

The financial side of the club is going well and the worst is behind. So why are we totally preoccupied with milking our revenue from games against “big sides”? The focus has to be football and manipulating the draw so we play against weaker sides and thus improve our win/loss ratio.

We have been patient long enough. Now is the time to start winning games and ultimately reach the finals. We can do this by looking to play the weaker sides twice, but at the same time generating revenue from the Carlton/Essendon games.

Hawthorn and Richmond make demands to play us twice. They do this because it raises their revenue and basically this is using Collingwood because of its support. Where is the return for us? They use us for our support and we get nothing in return from it. Why can’t we demand something in return for this?

I can’t put help but think it is also taxing on our most important commodity, the youngsters of Collingwood. Continually playing these big games makes the season longer and this is a major reason why players such as Josh Fraser are being run into the ground.

It’s great to demand the games and go by the “lets take them all on” attitude but it is bordering on stupidity. We are losing games, our youngsters are taking a physical and mental battering just so some administrators can boast come election time about their finances.


In Skob We Trust

[Northern Pie]

Once again I refer you to the "What if" factor.....

What If....We get our wish and we get to play say St. Kilda, West Coast and Fremantle twice in one season, say next year and with priority picks for West Coast and Freo and if the Saints can get it together..they beat us as a Up and coming type teams.

What If....we play these "bigger" teams twice in the year and we get play well and just get over the line in both games (which is also very mentally & physically challenging)we make it to the finals and we get belted...

or

What if...We perform well against these big sides give htem a hard tough game and give them a belting..come finals time when we finish in the top 4 any team we play will fear us because we have shown through the year that we can easily accomodate the previous years "power" teams.

I want a situation where we have the sort of team that is feared by all in the competition, I want a situation where we can look at the draw and just laugh because we know that it doesn't matter who we play twice we will thrash em...I think we are closer than some may think...

I think that the attitude the administration has is a healthy one..I think Eddie genuinely wants what is best for the team, I was always told by my coach that "it doesn't matter how good you think your opponent is, what matters is what you think of yourself and how much better you are than he is!" We should not be worrying about who we have to play we should be thinking of how we should be playing...

Cheers

(forgive my rantings I hope it makes sense..1:48am)

[MarkT]

Northern Pie,
No matter what, I would prefer to play WCE, Freeo & Saints twice next year. Throw in Melb. to that lot (ie bottom 4). All in all, we would be better off. I'd be happy to play top 3 aqnd bottom 4 twice. We would make the 8 on an analysis of this year.

I agree with the comments that we need to be good enough to beat anyone but right now we are not. That is what it comes down to. Make the finals of watch 'em.

As I have said before, the club has done a great job to date balancing a sustainable improvement with financial stability and moving into the new millenium. Given where we were, we have come a long way.

As far as we have come, we are still not playing finals. What ever it takes to make us play finals next year is the minimum requirement. I think our long term future depends more on next seasons on field results than any other single factor. There can be no excuses any more. No rebuilding, no fiscal responsibility, no draft difficulties no excuses. We have the basis for a very good side. Our deficiencies are obvious. Equally obvious is the fact that our deficiencies are remediable and must be addressed.

A couple of recruits (espec. Ruck) and a fair draw and I will be putting my house on a finals appearance. I can see but I can't yet touch it.

[B&W Phantom]

O.K. I will throw in my two cents worth. I realise that most of you in here are disappointed with the result this year and are searching for reasons why we may not have done so well. To place blame upon the draw gives us comfort in the knowledge that outside influences destroyed our chances of playing finals footy. I agree that the draw seemed tough this year, and I believe we will probably on most occasions play the big teams twice in one year. I believe the only reason why we lost against Carlscum was because of how hard the boys played against the Don's. I still think this was our best performance all year. I think the juice was a bit low coming into the Carlton game. I do not think they were physically weak but mentally weak. Why? The answer is in how the senior players of the team faired. Buckley, Monty, Molloy, all played well as they understand that mental fitness is as important as physical. Unlike physical fitness, mental fitness relies upon the person. This was a big game and they knew it. However, I believe they expended a lot of that mental toughness upon the Don's leaving them look flat and uninterested. These boys are only young and will learn how to apply themselves mentally. That is the reason why we did not make the finals this year. The draw is of no consequence the boys just need to be tougher physically and mentally.

[stik35]

Even though it's tough playing the Blockbusters I would much rather be in them than watch the other top teams play them while we play Freo & West Coast. We must match it with the best to be the best. Besides, we don't always beat the crap teams but have put up a good fight against some of the best.

[Spidergirl]

stik35 that is the attitude that has been killing Collingwood for years now....that near enough is good enough! We should be winning not just putting up a good fight. I'm tired of people accepting defeat.

I agree though that it would suck if we were playing the bottom teams and watching others in blockbuster games that we should be in but maybe the boys would see what they are missing out on then. I think Anzac Day is by far the most traditional game that i certainly look forward to every year so we should just keep that as our main blockbuster game and forget the rest if thats possible!

Another thing is i'm bloody tired of these false calls to have to book tickets and that its gonna be a sellout for these games. I pay my membership to damm well get in the gate on what i have forked out at the start of the year (300 for social club) not to pay extra to ticketmaster or AFL or whoever else is raking it up!

[stik35]

Spidergirl you have misunderstood me. I actually said
-we must match it with the best to be the best-
Obviously near enough has NOT been good enough nor should it be.

[Joel]

We have to stop playing "BLOCKBUSTER" games, except for againt Essendon, Carlton and Richmond. The rest should be random. The AFL should stop making a BIASED draw against Collingwood, what would they rather...a Collingwood out of the finals or in it?

Sure we have to match it with the stronger teams but guys we do play these teams atleast once, whether we play them twice is almost irrelavant.

JDF

[marsell11]

Are you kidding me? Collingwood asks for the blockbuster games. If any Collingwood supporter has a problem with the draw, then take it up with Eddie - not just the AFL.

Collingwood reaps huge financial benefits from playing teams like Essendon and Carlton, so whoever said they didn't is an idiot. Sure Collingwood has to play the big games because they are big drawers, but I'm sure there wouldn't be any complaints if Essendon, Carlton and Richmond were in the bottom 8 and not all top 4 or in contention for the top 4. It's sounds like circumstancial whinging to me.

It's not like the Pies are being victimised - everyone gets a dodgy draw - some recent examples I can think of is Hawthorn last year, they had to play in every other state at least once - and then there's the interstate clubs who have to travel for every second game...now that's tough.

The draw is always going to be lopsided as long as every team doesn't play every other team twice in a year.

[Rohan Coventry Tateson]

The draw Collingwood gets is the hardest in the AFL. That is very obvious.

Collingwood contributes to this hard draw by demanding blockbuster games against big drawing or well performing sides.

The point of my argument is that a balance in the hardness of the draw should be struck. That is having easier games while retaining the traditional games (Essendon, Carlton).

Carlton and Essendon have these blockbuster games and also have a balance of easier games (return games against West Coast, St Kilda, Fremantle etc.)

It makes financial sense to play other blockbuster games. But it also makes sense to play against weaker opposition which may lead to finals, and ultimately play in finals which generate as much turnover as these blockbuster games.

Next year is a crucial year for the football club. If we don't make finals there are going to be some serious questions asked.

The finances are in good shape and the time is too deliver on the field. It's not the time to be bravo and ask games against every top team, it's the time to be smart about it and make the finals.

You do this by trying to get a draw, which isn't the hardest in the AFL.

Baa Baa



In Skob We Trust