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Joel 
Joined: 23 Mar 1999
Location: Mornington Peninsula
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| Post subject: Bombers Web Sham Exposed |  |
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Head over to Buckley Surfers to read this article:
http://www.geocities.com/buckleysurfers2003/websham.html
Driver has done some investigations on the domain names that Essendon supposedly bought off Jimmy and Velvet Sledgehammer. Interesting. |
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The Prototype 
Paint my face with a good-for-nothin smile.
Joined: 23 Apr 2003
Location: Hobart, Tasmania
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JLC 
Joined: 30 May 2000
Location: Keysborough still representing Hot Pies
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Great news 
jlc
_________________
The Torres bounce is officially dead. You are walking alone now Fernando. |
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Net_Nerd
Joined: 04 Jun 2003
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Over on TBV we went through this 6 months ago and the domains were legit
mattlloyd.com.au
jameshird.com.au
Domain Name: mattlloyd.com.au
Last Modified: 15-Nov-2002 22:30:56 UTC
Registrar ID: R00010-AR
Registrar Name: Melbourne IT
Status: ok
Registrant: Matthew Lloyd
Registrant ID: OTHER 000000000
Registrant ROID: C0447544-AR
Registrant Contact Name: THE MANAGER
Registrant Email: andrewn@flyingstart.com.au
Domain Name: jameshird.com.au
Last Modified: 16-Nov-2002 02:42:07 UTC
Registrar ID: R00010-AR
Registrar Name: Melbourne IT
Status: ok
Registrant: James Hird
Registrant ID: OTHER 000000000
Registrant ROID: C0381829-AR
Registrant Contact Name: THE MANAGER
Registrant Email: andrewn@flyingstart.com.au
They've just expired and the auDA (the government tossers that operate Australian domain names) put in place new rules last year banning individuals from owning com.au domain names and creating id.au, so Lloyd & Hird/Essendon couldn't re-register them even if they wanted after they expired
While it's always great to kick the Bummers over this stuff this 'web sham' isn't really a 'web sham'
| Quote: | | A search of the Australian domain name registry finds that jameshird.com.au is also an unregistered domain name. Anyone with a credit card could buy this web name right now without having to pay $50,000 as Essendon supposedly did. |
Anybody with a credit card can't buy this domain under the auDA new rules only an Australian registered business with an ABN named "James Hird Pty Ltd" etc could purchase it
The 'investigative reporter' didn't investigate well enough and has his facts wrong and ends up looking like a bit of a goose |
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Mike 
Joined: 20 Sep 1996
Location: Lilydale, Tas.
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That's not a new rule Net_Nerd. The rules have been changed, true, but they've actually been relaxed. A .com.au domain name must be constructed from an Australian business name or company name. The new rules also alow you to register a .com.au domain name if the name describes a product or service that your business provides. If James Hird and Matthew LLoyd had .com.au domains it only means that they must be using their own names as business/trading names - which is to be expected of an AFL footballer. They can still own those domains - that rule has not changed.
What else that has not changed is the fact that Australian domain names are not transferrable. Essendon Football Club could not have purchased those domain names from either of the players because the names can't be transferred. Australian domain names have never been transferrable.
Who's the goose? |
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Blanch 
Joined: 01 Jul 2002
Location: Back in Perth!
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So if Essenscum can't register these Id domain names then what did they buy? Has Essenscum bought something unuseable to them? Such a big asset lost to Essenscum? Why haven't we heard them going nuts over the loss of their newly aquired assets because of the new ruling?
Simple answer is because it is a sham and always was. If it wasn't a sham then they would have done something with the domain names already and we'd be able to see what they bought.
btw, the auDA are open to be sued for loss of income generated by these non existent websites. Essenscum entered into an agreement that cost them a 6 figure sum. It would be fair argument to say that these domain names could have made them money. A change of the rules would entitle them to some form of compensation for not being able to use them.
Again, why have they not pursued these avenues? Because it's a salary cap dodge. No matter which way you look at it, logic suggests its a sham.
_________________
My oxygen is Collingwood. Without it I die.
All WA Magpies join the Western Magpies now:
http://www.westernmagpies.com
(At least go and sign the guestbook). |
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Mike
Joined: 20 Sep 1996
Location: Lilydale, Tas.
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| Quote: | | A change of the rules would entitle them to some form of compensation for not being able to use them. |
Blanch, I just finished pointing out that the rules were relaxed, not tightened.
The fact remains that Essendon Football Club could not have bought .com.au domain names from either player because Australian domain names are not transferrable - story ends. |
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Net_Nerd
Joined: 04 Jun 2003
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| Of course it is a salary cap dodge, but the whole premise of the Buckley Surfers story was that the domains never existed in the first place (which they did) ie. goose |
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Net_Nerd
Joined: 04 Jun 2003
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| Mike wrote: | That's not a new rule Net_Nerd. The rules have been changed, true, but they've actually been relaxed. A .com.au domain name must be constructed from an Australian business name or company name. The new rules also alow you to register a .com.au domain name if the name describes a product or service that your business provides. If James Hird and Matthew LLoyd had .com.au domains it only means that they must be using their own names as business/trading names - which is to be expected of an AFL footballer. They can still own those domains - that rule has not changed.
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ELIGIBILITY AND ALLOCATION RULES FOR COM.AU
The com.au 2LD is for commercial purposes.
The following rules are to be read in conjunction with the Eligibility and Allocation Rules for All Open
2LDs, contained in Schedule A of this document.
1. To be eligible for a domain name in the com.au 2LD, registrants must be:
a) an Australian registered company; or
b) trading under a registered business name in any Australian State or Territory; or
c) an Australian partnership or sole trader;
d) a foreign company licensed to trade in Australia; or
e) an owner of an Australian Registered Trade Mark; or
f) an applicant for an Australian Registered Trade Mark(1); or
g) an association incorporated in any Australian State or Territory; or
h) an Australian commercial statutory body.
2. Domain names in the com.au 2LD must:
a) exactly match:
(i) the registrant's company, business, trading, association or statutory body name; or
(ii) the words comprising the registrant’s Australian Registered Trade Mark or application for an
Australian Registered Trade Mark; or
b) be an acronym or abbreviation of 2a) (i) or (ii); or
c) be otherwise closely and substantially connected to the registrant, because the domain name refers to.
(i) a product that the registrant manufactures or sells; or
(ii) a service that the registrant provides; or
(iii) an event that the registrant organises or sponsors; or
(iv) an activity that the registrant facilitates, teaches or trains; or
(v) a venue that the registrant operates; or
(vi) a profession that the registrant's employees practise.
These are the new guidelines
No way imho that Essendon can register a com.au for a player (manufactures, sells, service provides wouldn't wash) |
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Kristin5 
Fiery Redhead
Joined: 19 Apr 2001
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Actually Mike, I transferred an Australian domain name from one owner to another a couple of months back - it was a difficult task but it could be done (due to the sale of the business to another party). I needed to complete a Transfer of Ownership form and include a copy of the Sale Agreement (and of course pay a fee, I think it was $339).
_________________
"I'm sure people see me as a screaming redhead with a big pair of boobs, but I like to think I've got things to say." Geri Halliwell, former member of the Spice Girls. |
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Net_Nerd
Joined: 04 Jun 2003
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[quote="Mike"] | Quote: | | The fact remains that Essendon Football Club could not have bought .com.au domain names from either player because Australian domain names are not transferrable - story ends. |
Yes they are
http://www.auda.org.au/docs/auda-2002-27.txt |
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Mike
Joined: 20 Sep 1996
Location: Lilydale, Tas.
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If you are going to quote a document net nerd you should read it first.
The transfers allowed for in that document allow for businesses being sold or wound up or registrants dying. Hardly a normal transfer.
A domain name may be transferred only in extraordinary circumstances and then only if "the transfer does not constitute a breach of the prohibition on sale of a domain name by a registrant (auDA Published Policy 2002-24)."
So my statement above that states that a domain name is not transferrable should have said that an Australian domain name cannot be sold - little difference. The sale of a domain name is expressly prohibited by auDA and always has been. So tell me how the Essendon Football Club managed to buy the domains from the players?
auDA Policy No: 2002-24 states:
2.1 There are no proprietary rights in a domain name. A registrant does not "own" their domain name, instead they hold a licence to use the domain name for a specified period of time and subject to the licence terms and conditions.
2.2 Because the registrant does not have a proprietary right in the domain name, it is not legally possible for the registrant to "sell" the domain name. By offering to sell their domain name to another party, the registrant is in breach of the terms and conditions of their domain name licence. |
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Net_Nerd
Joined: 04 Jun 2003
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| Mike wrote: | If you are going to quote a document net nerd you should read it first.
The transfers allowed for in that document allow for businesses being sold or wound up or registrants dying. Hardly a normal transfer.
A domain name may be transferred only if "the transfer does not constitute a breach of the prohibition on sale of a domain name by
a registrant (auDA Published Policy 2002-24)."
So my statement above that states that a domain name is not transferrable should have said that an Australian domain name cannot be sold - little difference. The sale of a domain name is expressly prohibited by auDA and always has been. So tell me how the Essendon Football Club managed to buy the domains from the players? |
Death is only one point
3. CIRCUMSTANCES OF TRANSFER
3.1 A registrant may transfer their domain name licence to a proposed new registrant if:
a) (i) the domain name is used within the operations of the registrant and either the registrant or the operations are acquired by, merged into, devolved to or joined with the operations of the proposed new registrant; or
is the relevant one in this case
And from what I know of the Bummer case, they didn't actually transfer the domains to them directly and they remained owned & registered to the individuals themselves via Flying Start on the actual domain registrar but the Bummers drew up a legal document (and paid $$$$) with Lloyd & Hird agreeing not to use their domains against the club in a rival operation against their own website
Enough of this, stuff em, stuff em all 
I've spent an afternoon on a Magpie website arguing nerd talk, I feel all dirty now  |
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Mike
Joined: 20 Sep 1996
Location: Lilydale, Tas.
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lol you blue dummy, you've done it again - can't you read? What I said was (and you quoted) "businesses being sold or wound up or registrants dying".
That clause says that you may transfer the domain if the registrant or his operations have been merged into or acquired by the new owner. If the Essendon Football Club had bought the entire business of those two players the domain names wouldn't even be an issue. The fact is that the Essendon Football Club did not buy or assume the businesses of those two footballers, so that clause does not apply.
I'm glad you've had enough because you're about to be removed anyway. |
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Nova Kaine 
Winners never quit, and quitters NEVER win.
Joined: 05 May 2003
Location: Glenorchy, Tasmania
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I'm lucky I don't know any of this  It always pays to play dumb...although sometimes it's a pain in the ass
_________________
"The minute you start talking about what you're going to do if you lose, you have lost." |
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