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| Nathan Buckley - What should the club do with him? |
| Sack him now (not playing finals, get started on a replacement) |
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25% |
[ 35 ] |
| Sack him end of season (not the man but why concede the year now?) |
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8% |
[ 12 ] |
| Sack him on the run home (if the wheels have really fallen off) |
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0% |
[ 1 ] |
| Decide end of season (I'm still in his corner) |
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10% |
[ 14 ] |
| Decide end of season (He's just not up to it) |
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6% |
[ 9 ] |
| Decide end of season (I'm honestly undecided) |
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11% |
[ 16 ] |
| Re-sign him on the run home (fait accompli, just pick our moment) |
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4% |
[ 6 ] |
| Re-sign him end of season (he's the man, but no need to rush) |
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8% |
[ 12 ] |
| Re-sign him now (he WILL be our next premiership coach!) |
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18% |
[ 25 ] |
| I really don't know (but I will back the club whatever it decides) |
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4% |
[ 6 ] |
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| Total Votes : 136 |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| There exists Bucks did not. |
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Redlight
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
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| Magpietothemax wrote: | | The argument that it is player deficiencies and not coaching doesn't cut it.This is the team Bucks has been steering towards.He has had 6 years at the helm, establishing his vision of what a Premiership contending team needs to be.All the decisions made over the last 6 years were in line with this vision.If Bucks did not have a major hand in the actual recruitment process, then at the very least Hine was recruiting in accordance with the Buckley vision. Not so long ago (1 to 2 years) many commentators were speaking highly of the quality on Collingwood's list and were predicting an imminent rise up the ladder as the young players matured. Adam Treloar preferred Collingwood to Richmond because of the quality on Collingwood's listif you remember. Now these same commentators are changing their tune. Our list now has major issues.So if you go with the"it's the players not the coaching" line you must concede that there have been massive errors of judgement and direction. And i am afraid that the responsibility for these, while shared by many,still ultimately falls at the feet of Bucks. |
Commentators/journalists largely just take the evidence of the moment, when a team is winning they're all champions, when they're losing they're all rubbish. They have no view to the past and no particular skill at predicting the future.
They're like a person pointing at the rain through the window and claiming to be a meteorologist. |
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Raw Hammer
Joined: 11 Sep 2008
Location: The Gutter
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David King is an expert in this field!
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think positive 
Side By Side
Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | i hate carlton wrote: | On AFL Game Day today Leigh Matthews said that "Collingwood have performed at about where their list should be in my view, and if Wells had played the whole year they would have one anther two or three games..."
FFS can we just appreciate that Bucks has got the best out of the team that he can, and that sometimes better than the team should have been.
He will deliver us premierships, of that I am certain. |
I'm with you ihc. I still expect Bucks to get a contract extension and coach us to our next flag. Sure, we've lost more games than we've won, but this has been due to player deficiencies not because of poor coaching. |
Would you say all of the players on the list are playing to their full potential?
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You cant fix stupid, turns out you cant quarantine it either! |
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Magpietothemax 
magpietothemax
Joined: 27 Apr 2013
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| Redlight wrote: | | Magpietothemax wrote: | | The argument that it is player deficiencies and not coaching doesn't cut it.This is the team Bucks has been steering towards.He has had 6 years at the helm, establishing his vision of what a Premiership contending team needs to be.All the decisions made over the last 6 years were in line with this vision.If Bucks did not have a major hand in the actual recruitment process, then at the very least Hine was recruiting in accordance with the Buckley vision. Not so long ago (1 to 2 years) many commentators were speaking highly of the quality on Collingwood's list and were predicting an imminent rise up the ladder as the young players matured. Adam Treloar preferred Collingwood to Richmond because of the quality on Collingwood's listif you remember. Now these same commentators are changing their tune. Our list now has major issues.So if you go with the"it's the players not the coaching" line you must concede that there have been massive errors of judgement and direction. And i am afraid that the responsibility for these, while shared by many,still ultimately falls at the feet of Bucks. |
Commentators/journalists largely just take the evidence of the moment, when a team is winning they're all champions, when they're losing they're all rubbish. They have no view to the past and no particular skill at predicting the future.
They're like a person pointing at the rain through the window and claiming to be a meteorologist. |
No doubt that the commentators are based on surface impressions only. But it needs to be pointed out that at the time these predictions were made, we weren't having success on the field, yet these commentators were still predicting a very quick turnaround as the list matured. This was due to the hype of Pert no doubt, and to Buck's own statements about when he expected us to make finals. I am not attributing any particular skill to the commentators. I am simply saying that if you accept the argument that our list is deficient, then it means that Buckley and the club have made gross misjudgments |
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i hate carlton
Joined: 05 May 2014
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| think positive wrote: | | RudeBoy wrote: | | i hate carlton wrote: | On AFL Game Day today Leigh Matthews said that "Collingwood have performed at about where their list should be in my view, and if Wells had played the whole year they would have one anther two or three games..."
FFS can we just appreciate that Bucks has got the best out of the team that he can, and that sometimes better than the team should have been.
He will deliver us premierships, of that I am certain. |
I'm with you ihc. I still expect Bucks to get a contract extension and coach us to our next flag. Sure, we've lost more games than we've won, but this has been due to player deficiencies not because of poor coaching. |
Would you say all of the players on the list are playing to their full potential? |
No!
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He's kicking pineapples!
My favourite nicks thread (Laugh at Carlscum): http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/viewtopic.php?t=66021&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
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What'sinaname
Joined: 29 May 2010
Location: Living rent free
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Swans start 0-6 and are 9-1 since. Can we sign Longmire?
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Fighting against the objectification of woman. |
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i hate carlton
Joined: 05 May 2014
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| Lone Ranger wrote: | | The goal of the coach is to win flags. To do that, you have to improve the win/loss ratio to get to finals. In the statistic of improving the win/loss ratio, Buckley is the worst coach in history of the AFL. |
The coach is but one metric in a complex measure of success and failure. There are others, but the days when Jock and the board would sack a coach because they reckon that will get them immediate success are gonnnnnnne.
Strategy and tactics are long term and short term. You cant sacrifice the long term for the short term.
_________________
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He's kicking pineapples!
My favourite nicks thread (Laugh at Carlscum): http://www.magpies.net/nick/bb/viewtopic.php?t=66021&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
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ROB
Joined: 13 Sep 2016
Location: Sydney
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| i hate carlton wrote: | | Lone Ranger wrote: | | The goal of the coach is to win flags. To do that, you have to improve the win/loss ratio to get to finals. In the statistic of improving the win/loss ratio, Buckley is the worst coach in history of the AFL. |
The coach is but one metric in a complex measure of success and failure. There are others, but the days when Jock and the board would sack a coach because they reckon that will get them immediate success are gonnnnnnne.
Strategy and tactics are long term and short term. You cant sacrifice the long term for the short term. |
Agree entirely - well articulated.
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Toby for President |
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RudeBoy
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
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| think positive wrote: | | RudeBoy wrote: | | i hate carlton wrote: | On AFL Game Day today Leigh Matthews said that "Collingwood have performed at about where their list should be in my view, and if Wells had played the whole year they would have one anther two or three games..."
FFS can we just appreciate that Bucks has got the best out of the team that he can, and that sometimes better than the team should have been.
He will deliver us premierships, of that I am certain. |
I'm with you ihc. I still expect Bucks to get a contract extension and coach us to our next flag. Sure, we've lost more games than we've won, but this has been due to player deficiencies not because of poor coaching. |
Would you say all of the players on the list are playing to their full potential? |
I don't think ALL the players on any team's list play to their FULL potential. However, I've been saying all season that structural weakness in terms of lack of dominant KPPs, has been the single most important factor holding back our team. Given this important structural weakness, it's a credit to Bucks that he has kept us competitive all season, despite our poor win/loss record. That suggests to me that we are on the verge of significant improvement. It's clear to me, though not to many Nicksters it seems, that the players are fully invested in Bucks' coaching style and so I think it would be a terrible mistake and a retrograde step to blame Bucks for, what to me at least, seem to be clear list management failures. Clever recruitment in the off season can quickly rectify these problems imo. |
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5 from the wing on debut
Joined: 27 May 2016
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| RudeBoy wrote: | | think positive wrote: | | RudeBoy wrote: | | i hate carlton wrote: | On AFL Game Day today Leigh Matthews said that "Collingwood have performed at about where their list should be in my view, and if Wells had played the whole year they would have one anther two or three games..."
FFS can we just appreciate that Bucks has got the best out of the team that he can, and that sometimes better than the team should have been.
He will deliver us premierships, of that I am certain. |
I'm with you ihc. I still expect Bucks to get a contract extension and coach us to our next flag. Sure, we've lost more games than we've won, but this has been due to player deficiencies not because of poor coaching. |
Would you say all of the players on the list are playing to their full potential? |
I don't think ALL the players on any team's list play to their FULL potential. However, I've been saying all season that structural weakness in terms of lack of dominant KPPs, has been the single most important factor holding back our team. Given this important structural weakness, it's a credit to Bucks that he has kept us competitive all season, despite our poor win/loss record. That suggests to me that we are on the verge of significant improvement. It's clear to me, though not to many Nicksters it seems, that the players are fully invested in Bucks' coaching style and so I think it would be a terrible mistake and a retrograde step to blame Bucks for, what to me at least, seem to be clear list management failures. Clever recruitment in the off season can quickly rectify these problems imo. |
I agree that the clever recruitment of the new coach in the off season will quickly rectify the problems. |
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regan is true fullback
Joined: 27 Dec 2002
Location: Granville. nsw
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Historian Shelby Foote said that Gettysburg was the terrible price the South paid for Robert E Lee.
Is the Malthouse/Buckley handover our Gettysburg? |
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Redlight
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
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| Magpietothemax wrote: | | No doubt that the commentators are based on surface impressions only. But it needs to be pointed out that at the time these predictions were made, we weren't having success on the field, yet these commentators were still predicting a very quick turnaround as the list matured. This was due to the hype of Pert no doubt, and to Buck's own statements about when he expected us to make finals. I am not attributing any particular skill to the commentators. I am simply saying that if you accept the argument that our list is deficient, then it means that Buckley and the club have made gross misjudgments |
If the list proves to be deficient then Buckley has to wear some of the responsibility for that. I'm just making the point that the media is generally correct either by fluke, or after the fact, and this despite all of their 'knowledge and experience at the top level'. |
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Doc63
Joined: 06 May 2004
Location: Newport
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| regan is true fullback wrote: | Historian Shelby Foote said that Gettysburg was the terrible price the South paid for Robert E Lee.
Is the Malthouse/Buckley handover our Gettysburg? |
Was he any relation to Dick Lee?
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I hold a cup of wisdom, but there is nothing within. |
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Lone Ranger
Joined: 02 Apr 2003
Location: Macedon Ranges
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| i hate carlton wrote: | | Lone Ranger wrote: | | The goal of the coach is to win flags. To do that, you have to improve the win/loss ratio to get to finals. In the statistic of improving the win/loss ratio, Buckley is the worst coach in history of the AFL. |
The coach is but one metric in a complex measure of success and failure. There are others, but the days when Jock and the board would sack a coach because they reckon that will get them immediate success are gonnnnnnne.
Strategy and tactics are long term and short term. You cant sacrifice the long term for the short term. |
He has never improved the win/loss ratio in 6 years. That's not long enough for you? Would 7 years of failure be enough? 8? |
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