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Cuthbert Collingwood 
Once was on fire, now all at sea
Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Location: The BBC (Brunswick Bowling Club)
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I visited Sharm el Sheikh and Dahab in the Sinai in Egypt in 2011. The Russian tourists had a terrible reputation and the locals really despised them. Taxi drivers, shopkeepers and restauranteurs that I spoke to talked about how they were treated like scum by Russians. They dive school operators also hated them as they stepped on, stole and killed the coral. So overall their reputation was similar to the boozy pommy tourist in Mediterranean resorts, with added arrogance, racism and general meanness, and the frustration that comes from these people being one of the larger sources of income for the area.
So when I first heard about the plane I said to my girlfriend that I wouldn't be surprised if it was blown up. IS or otherwise.
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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Cuthbert Collingwood wrote: | I visited Sharm el Sheikh and Dahab in the Sinai in Egypt in 2011. The Russian tourists had a terrible reputation and the locals really despised them. Taxi drivers, shopkeepers and restauranteurs that I spoke to talked about how they were treated like scum by Russians. They dive school operators also hated them as they stepped on, stole and killed the coral. So overall their reputation was similar to the boozy pommy tourist in Mediterranean resorts, with added arrogance, racism and general meanness, and the frustration that comes from these people being one of the larger sources of income for the area.
So when I first heard about the plane I said to my girlfriend that I wouldn't be surprised if it was blown up. IS or otherwise. |
Beautiful place the Sinai.
I was there for about 3 weeks in 1975 living in a sleeping bag at the then undeveloped Nuweiba when getting a sun tan was seen as desirable - my skin was ridiculously dark brown & my dark hair became bleached from the sun & the sea - marvellous snorkelling, scuba diving & swimming. The place was largely untouched by tourism under the Israelis.
At 18 also went on a type of 4 wheel drive / bus tour of the central Sinai & going to Santa Caterina church at the base of Mt Sinai where apparently the 10 commandments were given to Moses. Early morning climb to the peak to catch sunset. We also went to the southern most point of the Sinai - Ras Mohammed National Park - no fresh water was allowed to prevent long staying & preserve the environment - stunning in its beauty. Not sure what's happened to it post being handed over to the Egyptians.
In late 1981 went with Mrs WPT on a our backpacking holiday & spent a few weeks living in caves (as shelter) on the beach about 10 km before Sharmh-el-Sheikh at a place called Na'ama bay.
In those days you could safely hitch-hike.
On of my favourite places in the world.
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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3.14159 
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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| Cuthbert Collingwood wrote: | I visited Sharm el Sheikh and Dahab in the Sinai in Egypt in 2011. The Russian tourists had a terrible reputation and the locals really despised them. Taxi drivers, shopkeepers and restauranteurs that I spoke to talked about how they were treated like scum by Russians. They dive school operators also hated them as they stepped on, stole and killed the coral. So overall their reputation was similar to the boozy pommy tourist in Mediterranean resorts, with added arrogance, racism and general meanness, and the frustration that comes from these people being one of the larger sources of income for the area.
So when I first heard about the plane I said to my girlfriend that I wouldn't be surprised if it was blown up. IS or otherwise. |
WOW, what a turn around!
ISIS kills hundreds of Russians and suddenly it's Putin's (and ugly Russian tourists) fault!
FMD The Russian's Yanks and even us have dropping bombs on Sunnis for decades (often using it bolster flagging opinion polls at home) but suddenly it's all Russia got what was coming to it!
Phhht!
Last edited by 3.14159 on Thu Nov 05, 2015 11:17 am; edited 1 time in total |
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David 
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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| Cuthbert Collingwood wrote: | I visited Sharm el Sheikh and Dahab in the Sinai in Egypt in 2011. The Russian tourists had a terrible reputation and the locals really despised them. Taxi drivers, shopkeepers and restauranteurs that I spoke to talked about how they were treated like scum by Russians. They dive school operators also hated them as they stepped on, stole and killed the coral. So overall their reputation was similar to the boozy pommy tourist in Mediterranean resorts, with added arrogance, racism and general meanness, and the frustration that comes from these people being one of the larger sources of income for the area.
So when I first heard about the plane I said to my girlfriend that I wouldn't be surprised if it was blown up. IS or otherwise. |
It would certainly not surprise me to see Russians targeted by Sunni militants, given their intervention in Syria. But would they really have been able to tell that a given passenger plane was full of Russian civilians and manage to shoot it down in the time required? It seems far-fetched, but feel free to walk me through this.
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"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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| Interesting story. Tell me more. |
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Skids 
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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| David wrote: | | Cuthbert Collingwood wrote: | I visited Sharm el Sheikh and Dahab in the Sinai in Egypt in 2011. The Russian tourists had a terrible reputation and the locals really despised them. Taxi drivers, shopkeepers and restauranteurs that I spoke to talked about how they were treated like scum by Russians. They dive school operators also hated them as they stepped on, stole and killed the coral. So overall their reputation was similar to the boozy pommy tourist in Mediterranean resorts, with added arrogance, racism and general meanness, and the frustration that comes from these people being one of the larger sources of income for the area.
So when I first heard about the plane I said to my girlfriend that I wouldn't be surprised if it was blown up. IS or otherwise. |
It would certainly not surprise me to see Russians targeted by Sunni militants, given their intervention in Syria. But would they really have been able to tell that a given passenger plane was full of Russian civilians and manage to shoot it down in the time required? It seems far-fetched, but feel free to walk me through this. |
1US intelligence believes that ISIS or an affiliated terrorist group may have planted a bomb on the Russian flight that went down in Egypt's Sinai Peninsula on Saturday, a US official told CNN's Barbara Starr.
http://www.vox.com/2015/11/4/9671018/isis-bomb-russian-plane
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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Ah, see that's a bit more plausible. Still, with the airport security in this day and age...
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"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 05 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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It's unlikely ISIS shot down the Russian plane or assigned somebody with the task to plant a bomb on the plane but I won't rule it out completely. The most realistic conclusion is that they're doing this for propaganda purposes especially since Russia is relentless in its campaign to destroy ISIS and Assad's enemies in Syria.
ISIS also made similar claims in December last year when they claimed to have shot down the plane carrying the Jordanian pilot who was subsequently burnt to death by the group but there was actually no evidence to suggest they were behind the crash of the plane either.
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3.14159
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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| Jezza wrote: | It's unlikely ISIS shot down the Russian plane or assigned somebody with the task to plant a bomb on the plane but I won't rule it out completely. The most realistic conclusion is that they're doing this for propaganda purposes especially since Russia is relentless in its campaign to destroy ISIS and Assad's enemies in Syria.
ISIS also made similar claims in December last year when they claimed to have shot down the plane carrying the Jordanian pilot who was subsequently burnt to death by the group but there was actually no evidence to suggest they were behind the crash of the plane either. |
What do you mean it's unlikely?
Do you have access to the ISIS leadership (and Putin's inner most thoughts) or is this mere speculation to paint the Russians as cold-blooded killers only slightly worse than IS?
Seriously Jezza, Putin is a law unto himself, he doesn't need to kill hundreds of Russian civilians to pursue his policy of backing the Assad regime regardless of the cost to the Syrian people!
The downed Jordanian Air-force plane.
No evidence apart from a downed jet and it's captured pilot!
(or is that another cunning counter-counter-plan by those awful awful Rooskies?) |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 05 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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What's with the aggressive tone of your post?
I think you've misread my post. I was talking about ISIS propaganda NOT Russian propaganda plus I didn't accuse the Russian government of committing such an act against its own people.
Do you seriously believe ISIS has the capability to blow up a Russian plane because I don't believe they do? Outside of Syria and Iraq they barely have any influence or power as it is to mount such a systematic attack but I'm not suggesting that the Russian government is behind it whatsoever but I'm not also ruling out being proven wrong when it comes to the question of whether ISIS did indeed cause the plane crash.
What's Russia got to do with the Jordanian pilot? My point of mentioning that particular event was to demonstrate that ISIS has made unsubstantiated claims in the past such as shooting down the jet containing the Jordanian pilot even though there was no evidence to suggest they shot it down in the first place.
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David
to wish impossible things
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: the edge of the deep green sea
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Yeah, I don't think anyone's suggesting an inside job. That'd have to be a pretty barmy conspiracy theory. Technical failure still seems most likely, or perhaps a bomb if it was a deliberate act.
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"Every time we witness an injustice and do not act, we train our character to be passive in its presence." – Julian Assange |
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3.14159
Joined: 12 Sep 2009
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| Jezza wrote: | I think you've misread my post. I was talking about ISIS propaganda NOT Russian propaganda plus I didn't accuse the Russian government of committing such an act against its own people.
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Your right I misread your post and I apologise.
It seemed to me you were implying the Russians did it because ISIS couldn't.
The Jordanian pilot and jet I stihl take issue with.
When IS was formed it made off with the cream of US weaponry and the skihls to them.
These days there are so many jets (US, Australian Russian (to name a few) in the air above Syria/Iraq all trained in detecting a missile lock and how to avoid and destroy the operators.
So complete are the CAP' it is almost suicide to use the captured weapons.
The Jordanian aircraft wasn't fitted with the latest US missile counter-measures and the pilots not as comprehensively trianed or total communication with US AWAC's.
There is also the probablyit was just in the wrong place at the wrong time (it would most likely fly home alone, Jordan is to West, US airfield are to the East.
(Who ever fired it may have just got lucky, in war, it happens).
In the Sinai there is no such military air presence which would leave the operators the time and to get in, set-up, lock-on (passenger jets can't detect missile radars) fire and leave before anybody ever knew they were there!
Aggressive tone?
For the last 2 weeks my pathetic neighbours new boyfriend had been menacing with threats of a shovel and an axe to the back of my head.
I've told the police but I need proof so I have been a bit testy over the last little while. Put it down to me trying to deal with some serious shit but don't take it personally because I assure you it isn't.
Last edited by 3.14159 on Thu Nov 05, 2015 7:30 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jezza
2023 PREMIERS!
Joined: 05 Sep 2010
Location: Ponsford End
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No problem 3.14159.
Sorry if my post wasn't clear and was therefore misinterpreted in the first place.
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Morrigu 
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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Sometimes - not often granted - but sometimes I think we are lulled into a false sense of security re the screening etc that occurs.
I give you example A Your Honour:
We not that long ago flew from Melb to Singapore, out of Singapore to KL , out of KL to Kuching , out of Kuching to Sandakan, out of Sandakan to KL.
When packing to fly back to Melbourne from KL I found a rather large knife in my carry on backpack ( I had taken it to MotoGP at the Island the week before to cut the tomatoes for our sandwiches) I had no idea it was in there and it had been in there the whole trip and had not been detected by any screening - and it had been through much screening - nearly bloody died when I realised  
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