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K 



Joined: 09 Sep 2011


PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:28 am
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Sure, they are confidential observations, P4S. The question is whether they were appropriate. Simply being confidential does not imply they are appropriate. Partly this depends on who made them. (I have to check whether most or all school counsellors are clinical psychologists.)

Regardless, I question the appropriateness of "extremely low IQ", for example. If they haven't tested IQ, that's just not a precise thing to write, and quite frankly sounds rather offensive to me. If they have tested IQ, they should write the score (etc.), not their judgmental-sounding interpretation of it.

I'd also be concerned by "Ensure he has taken his medication". They might say they weren't the ones who prescribed it, but I'm not at all convinced that enforcing drug-taking is the role of anyone in the school. Worse, in (common) practice, people in schools can agitate for this kind of intervention, and once they do such agitating the inevitable result is the prescription appears. (Drugging children for alleged ADHD gets the most media attention.)
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Pies4shaw Leo

pies4shaw


Joined: 08 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:23 am
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I'm not really too interested in the topic. I was just responding to your specific question whether these things were "medical details" by pointing out that the "medical records" tag had been put on it by the newspaper, not the school.
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think positive Libra

Side By Side


Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Location: somewhere

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 4:01 pm
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K wrote:
Sure, they are confidential observations, P4S. The question is whether they were appropriate. Simply being confidential does not imply they are appropriate. Partly this depends on who made them. (I have to check whether most or all school counsellors are clinical psychologists.)

Regardless, I question the appropriateness of "extremely low IQ", for example. If they haven't tested IQ, that's just not a precise thing to write, and quite frankly sounds rather offensive to me. If they have tested IQ, they should write the score (etc.), not their judgmental-sounding interpretation of it.

I'd also be concerned by "Ensure he has taken his medication". They might say they weren't the ones who prescribed it, but I'm not at all convinced that enforcing drug-taking is the role of anyone in the school. Worse, in (common) practice, people in schools can agitate for this kind of intervention, and once they do such agitating the inevitable result is the prescription appears. (Drugging children for alleged ADHD gets the most media attention.)

nor is teaching manners, toilet training, and how to behave in a schooling kind of environment, but with so many lazy parents these days, they have no choice.

ive said previously i believe ADHD drugs are way over prescribed, but some kids do need a behaviour medication. there was a kid in my youngest class who was down right dangerous without his, he threw a brick through the principles window (im talking grade 1 here, so thats about 6 or 7) and attacked other kids. his parents were $£$%^%%$ disgusting. they split up and he moved away, I wasnt sorry but i have wondered what happened to the poor kid.

the IQ comment, well ok, its pretty average, but it was still supposed to be for school eyes only, and gee, I remember some of the comments teachers would write on our school reports back in the day! pretty tame by comparison!

it should not have been leaked, and it should not have been printed.

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K 



Joined: 09 Sep 2011


PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:12 pm
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think positive wrote:
...
ive said previously i believe ADHD drugs are way over prescribed, but some kids do need a behaviour medication. there was a kid in my youngest class who was down right dangerous without his, he threw a brick through the principles window (im talking grade 1 here, so thats about 6 or 7) and attacked other kids. his parents were $£$%^%%$ disgusting. they split up and he moved away, I wasnt sorry but i have wondered what happened to the poor kid.
...

Right on cue, the TV news just ran a story about this stuff. It seems really old, but maybe the study reported was updated. Either that, or they randomly run years-old stories.


"The most plausible explanation is that teachers provide the evidence for the diagnosis of ADHD, they assess the behaviour of these kids against their peers and they are mistaking age-related immaturity for a psychiatric disorder," Dr Whitely said.

"These kids, simply because they're the youngest kids in the class, are being given amphetamine-like drugs because they're young — younger than their classmates.

"Similar findings in North America indicated that developmental immaturity is mislabelled as a mental disorder and unnecessarily treated with stimulant medication."
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think positive Libra

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:35 pm
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Why do the parents give teachers so much say?
My eldest was the second youngest in her year level, immature, rather excitable yet no one ever suggested to me she needed drugs!

I could have used some Valium for a while there!

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K 



Joined: 09 Sep 2011


PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:23 pm
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This obviously refers to US law, because it's clearly a US website:

https://www.understood.org/en/learning-attention-issues/treatments-approaches/medications/can-a-school-make-medication-a-requirement-for-my-child-to-attend

"The law is very clear. Schools (along with districts and states) may not require any student, whether or not they get special education services, to take this class of medications.

That means three things. First, schools can’t make students take medication in order to attend. They also can’t make it a requirement for getting an evaluation and special education services.

Schools are allowed to share concerns with parents about a child’s behavior or performance in school, however. Teachers might describe what they’ve seen, or how a child’s behavior is getting in the way of learning. They can even suggest or request that a child be evaluated for special education.

There’s nothing in the law that prohibits teachers from suggesting medication, either. But it’s very bad practice, and they should avoid doing it."
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K 



Joined: 09 Sep 2011


PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:46 pm
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An Oz article:

https://www.themonthly.com.au/issue/2011/october/1317868852/gail-bell/prescribing-behaviour

"Later as I was transcribing our conversation I saw my notation “FITH”, a throwaway comment made as he bustled me out of his room. “Some kids just have FITH syndrome. We have to deal with it.”

FITH? F***ed in the head."
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stui magpie Gemini

Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.


Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto

PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:30 pm
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think positive wrote:
Why do the parents give teachers so much say?
My eldest was the second youngest in her year level, immature, rather excitable yet no one ever suggested to me she needed drugs!

I could have used some Valium for a while there!


My daughter repeated prep at primary school. Being 13 weeks prem may have had an impact, she was a smart enough kid but just struggled particularly with reading. Suddenly in about grade 2 or 3, something clicked and she went on from there

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HAL 

Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.


Joined: 17 Mar 2003


PostPosted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:31 pm
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What are the advantages to being 13 years old?
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