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HAL 

Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.


Joined: 17 Mar 2003


PostPosted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:36 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not sure I agree with your assumptions, like a sacrificial offering to assuage the British entertainment industry's collective guilt and shame for turning a blind eye to or condoning such behaviour on a widespread basis for the past half-century.
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David Libra

Reel around the fountain


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Anywhere, I don't care I don't care I don't care

PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:01 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

Mugwump wrote:
Take away context, and you subtract most of the meaning of any event. And while revenge is indeed an ugly emotion, where does retributive justice end and revenge take over ?


Alternatively, add context and, perhaps, we are given the opportunity to start excusing the act as being not as bad as we intuitively know it is. You do not need context or backstory to be disturbed by hearing about a man being cruelly beaten and killed – and so long as you can imagine that he may have done everything or nothing, I suspect that is the most ethically sound reaction.

In response to your question, the extent of valid retribution can really be adjusted to your taste. If you think torture should be prohibited in an ordinary judicial context, then that’s probably where you would draw the line. If you oppose capital punishment, as I do, then you would presumably oppose the killing of captured enemy combatants. And if you care about due process, you would seek for it to be applied in these cases too.

Nonetheless, in this case, without documentation and people wielding “proud ISIS member” lanyards, I doubt the inquisitors would ever have any cast-iron proof either – in many cases, they would at best be working from hearsay and at worst from pure guesswork. In some cases, like the Soviet soldiers who raped their way through the women of Berlin, all they would need is someone to catch their eye for whatever reason. Such is war.

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Past the pub that wrecks your body, and the church, all they want is your money; the Queen is dead, boys, and it's so lonely on a limb...
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Mugwump 



Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Oxford, England

PostPosted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:18 am
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^ well, I’m afraid disturbance is relative to context. I felt queasy at the video of Muammar Gaddafi being beaten and killed, but there is a level at which i was able to rationalize it as rough justice. I did not like it, but it was less “disturbing” than IS’s videos (I imagine, as I have not seen one, fortunately)

What the article depicts is wrong, whatever the man had done ; but the level of injustice is clearly dependent on context.

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David Libra

Reel around the fountain


Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Anywhere, I don't care I don't care I don't care

PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:08 am
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Iraq declares victory over ISIS:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/09/iraq-formally-declares-end-to-fight-against-islamic-state

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Past the pub that wrecks your body, and the church, all they want is your money; the Queen is dead, boys, and it's so lonely on a limb...
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Pies4shaw 

"Phil had more talent in his little finger than both Abletts combined displayed in their entire careers"


Joined: 08 Oct 2007


PostPosted: Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:27 am
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Great result. Now, we just have to sort out the Iraqis and then this particular country is nearly not a problem (much, really).
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