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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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Post subject: Best Collingwood midfield starting 18 - 1987-2017 | |
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Since we seem to want to pick almost an entire team of midfielders, I thought I'd go ahead and pick a starting 18 of midfielders from our teams from 1987 on and try to work out how many of our current crop would actually force their way into that side.
Grundy, Jolly, Daicos, Russell, Pendlebury, Swan, Buckley, Brown, Wright, Millane, McGuane, Shaw, Ball, Thomas, Burns, Paul Williams, Licca, Francis.
Would anyone else get a look-in? If so, who and why? |
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Pies2016
Joined: 12 Sep 2014
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Monkey ! |
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inxs88
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
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Dayne Beams is one of our best midfielders we have had in my 40 years! Ok so he is a traitor but he can do all of the following:
* kick both feet exceptionally well
* prolific
* inside and outside player
* goal kicker
* tough
* consistent
* endurance
* better than Sidebottom _________________ I love the Pies, hate Carlscum |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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I thought about Monkhurst rather than Jolly and went with Jolly only because of his goal-kicking record - but who would Beams displace? The only one I could possibly see would be Licuria but Licuria was much, much better at the business end of the season. Just to put that in context, Licuria was never a noted goal-kicker but he kicked the same number of goals in finals as Beams in about half as many finals games. Also, Licca's disposal average at home was 21, away it was 21 but in finals it was 24. By contrast, Beams' at home is 25, away is 25 and in finals is 18. Looked at another way, Sharrod Wellingham has kicked 4 times as many finals goals as Beams, even though most of his finals footy at the Wiggles has been played on the half-back flank.
Also, the suggestion that Beams is better than Sidebottom is a little irrelevant (since I don't think Sidey gets into the starting 18, either) but, bearing in mind that Beams is a year older, it's interesting to observe that Sidebottom has 16 Brownlow votes to Beams' 9 since Beams left Collingwood. Beams is an accumulator who doesn't hurt the opposition, unless he's kicking goals - that's why when Sidebottom played head to head against Beams in 2015, Sidebottom had 19 disposals and won the game for Collingwood in three quarters before he broke his hand, while Beams took the ball backwards over 30 times.
Even so, I guess the point of the thread was not so much whether there was some other past player that might have snuck in but whether any of the current midfield crop other than Grundy and Pendles would make a starting midfield 18. |
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Harrysz
Joined: 15 Oct 2001 Location: Melbourne
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Treloar. |
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HAL
Please don't shout at me - I can't help it.
Joined: 17 Mar 2003
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What do you look like? |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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In place of whom? And why? |
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qldmagpie67
Joined: 18 Dec 2008
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Pies4shaw wrote: | I thought about Monkhurst rather than Jolly and went with Jolly only because of his goal-kicking record - but who would Beams displace? The only one I could possibly see would be Licuria but Licuria was much, much better at the business end of the season. Just to put that in context, Licuria was never a noted goal-kicker but he kicked the same number of goals in finals as Beams in about half as many finals games. Also, Licca's disposal average at home was 21, away it was 21 but in finals it was 24. By contrast, Beams' at home is 25, away is 25 and in finals is 18. Looked at another way, Sharrod Wellingham has kicked 4 times as many finals goals as Beams, even though most of his finals footy at the Wiggles has been played on the half-back flank.
Also, the suggestion that Beams is better than Sidebottom is a little irrelevant (since I don't think Sidey gets into the starting 18, either) but, bearing in mind that Beams is a year older, it's interesting to observe that Sidebottom has 16 Brownlow votes to Beams' 9 since Beams left Collingwood. Beams is an accumulator who doesn't hurt the opposition, unless he's kicking goals - that's why when Sidebottom played head to head against Beams in 2015, Sidebottom had 19 disposals and won the game for Collingwood in three quarters before he broke his hand, while Beams took the ball backwards over 30 times.
Even so, I guess the point of the thread was not so much whether there was some other past player that might have snuck in but whether any of the current midfield crop other than Grundy and Pendles would make a starting midfield 18. |
Interesting comparison Beams has played 16 games for the Lions getting 9 Brownlow votes (not including this year as no one knows the Brownlow votes yet) so Beams averages a vote every second game. Over the same time Sidey played 36 games for 16 votes or less than a vote every second game.
Career wise Beams has 53 Brownlow votes in 128 games compared to 179 for 44 votes. Beams has been judged best on ground 9 times compared to Sidey's 6 times but Beams has played 51 less games so on Beams averages he would have another 21 votes and 4 more best on grounds if he had played the same amount of games working the averages.
This season I wouldn't know how many Brownlow votes Beams will get because I don't follow the lions but I'm guessing it will be double digits again while Sidey depending on how we go the remainder of the year might have 6 or 7 votes for the season so far (1x3, 1x2, 2x1) by my reckoning
It's really a matter of preference. If you want your team to make finals you select Beams as his output across the whole season is far superior but if you just want someone to play well in 1 or 2 finals matches you take Sidey and hope,th likes of Beams can win you enough games during the season to get you there.
Personally I wouldn't have either in front of anyone you selected all those selected offer a lot of positives |
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inxs88
Joined: 17 Aug 2014
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Pies4shaw wrote: | I thought about Monkhurst rather than Jolly and went with Jolly only because of his goal-kicking record - but who would Beams displace? The only one I could possibly see would be Licuria but Licuria was much, much better at the business end of the season. Just to put that in context, Licuria was never a noted goal-kicker but he kicked the same number of goals in finals as Beams in about half as many finals games. Also, Licca's disposal average at home was 21, away it was 21 but in finals it was 24. By contrast, Beams' at home is 25, away is 25 and in finals is 18. Looked at another way, Sharrod Wellingham has kicked 4 times as many finals goals as Beams, even though most of his finals footy at the Wiggles has been played on the half-back flank.
Also, the suggestion that Beams is better than Sidebottom is a little irrelevant (since I don't think Sidey gets into the starting 18, either) but, bearing in mind that Beams is a year older, it's interesting to observe that Sidebottom has 16 Brownlow votes to Beams' 9 since Beams left Collingwood. Beams is an accumulator who doesn't hurt the opposition, unless he's kicking goals - that's why when Sidebottom played head to head against Beams in 2015, Sidebottom had 19 disposals and won the game for Collingwood in three quarters before he broke his hand, while Beams took the ball backwards over 30 times.
Even so, I guess the point of the thread was not so much whether there was some other past player that might have snuck in but whether any of the current midfield crop other than Grundy and Pendles would make a starting midfield 18. |
Wow, calling Beams an accumulator vs Dinky kick Sidebottom is absurd _________________ I love the Pies, hate Carlscum |
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mattdally
Joined: 21 Feb 2003 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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IN: Didak
OUT: Russell / Francis |
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mattdally
Joined: 21 Feb 2003 Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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IN: Didak
OUT: Russell / Francis |
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3rd degree
Joined: 22 Jun 2004 Location: John Wren's tote
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mattdally wrote: | IN: Didak
OUT: Russell / Francis |
A hard one, I really rated Tony Francis , very tough and could kick goals.
I liked him more than Russell who was probably more classy, But Didak had more freakish skills than either of them. _________________ " Ohhh Banksy and out comes the Note Book".
www.facebook/the hybernators |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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Post subject: | |
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inxs88 wrote: | Pies4shaw wrote: | I thought about Monkhurst rather than Jolly and went with Jolly only because of his goal-kicking record - but who would Beams displace? The only one I could possibly see would be Licuria but Licuria was much, much better at the business end of the season. Just to put that in context, Licuria was never a noted goal-kicker but he kicked the same number of goals in finals as Beams in about half as many finals games. Also, Licca's disposal average at home was 21, away it was 21 but in finals it was 24. By contrast, Beams' at home is 25, away is 25 and in finals is 18. Looked at another way, Sharrod Wellingham has kicked 4 times as many finals goals as Beams, even though most of his finals footy at the Wiggles has been played on the half-back flank.
Also, the suggestion that Beams is better than Sidebottom is a little irrelevant (since I don't think Sidey gets into the starting 18, either) but, bearing in mind that Beams is a year older, it's interesting to observe that Sidebottom has 16 Brownlow votes to Beams' 9 since Beams left Collingwood. Beams is an accumulator who doesn't hurt the opposition, unless he's kicking goals - that's why when Sidebottom played head to head against Beams in 2015, Sidebottom had 19 disposals and won the game for Collingwood in three quarters before he broke his hand, while Beams took the ball backwards over 30 times.
Even so, I guess the point of the thread was not so much whether there was some other past player that might have snuck in but whether any of the current midfield crop other than Grundy and Pendles would make a starting midfield 18. |
Wow, calling Beams an accumulator vs Dinky kick Sidebottom is absurd |
OK. I just prefer the guys who turn up to play in finals. It's always been a weakness in my analysis, I suppose - I'm a bit biased in favour of guys who still touch the ball when the going is hard. |
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Pies4shaw
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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Dids was a great player. I guess I think of him more as a forward who played mid in bursts. Happy to have him ahead of Francis, though. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005 Location: In flagrante delicto
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Fraser _________________ Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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