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watt price tully 
Joined: 15 May 2007
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| Culprit wrote: | | watt price tully wrote: | | Culprit wrote: | ^^Prison led economic recovery.  In saying that the cost to house one prisoner is $55000 (approx) per year and rising. We have privatised the prison system so companies like G4S are making a killing off the tax payer. |
Are you sure Culprit? $55K Sounds well under to me |
Actually I am way under as per 2014/15 figures it's $297.34 per day which is $108,000 per year approx. With 6219 Prisoners in the System that is $1,849,157.46 per day which is $674,942,472.90 per year. I would suggest that this is even higher WPT. So whilst we have the push to deny bail and parole at all costs, the fiscal ramifications are pretty clear.
http://www.corrections.vic.gov.au/utility/publications+manuals+and+statistics/corrections+statistics+quick+reference |
Cheers for the leg work Culprit.
I have one of those useless bits of info in my head of a figure a few years ago in relation to cost per year per person of over $100K
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“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman |
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Culprit 
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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^^Happy to do so as it made my point even bigger  |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| think positive wrote: | How about a system similar to life outside? Or what it used to be before respect became obsolete.
Give all prisoners jobs, let them work their way up. Start cleaning toilets, have workshops where inmates can build furniture, even if it's just assembling IKEA flatpacks for elderly, nursing homes, hospitals. Stuff that can be outsourced without being compromised. Reward those that work hard, do the right thing. And those that refuse get nought. No telly, just old books. Give gem not just physical skills but the change in attitude to want to keep it up when they get out. |
I like it. I feel if we can gather everyone's views and put them together we will have a better system. The trouble is this is going to be a political review and both major parties are using law and order to grab votes. |
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stui magpie 
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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| Culprit wrote: | | think positive wrote: | How about a system similar to life outside? Or what it used to be before respect became obsolete.
Give all prisoners jobs, let them work their way up. Start cleaning toilets, have workshops where inmates can build furniture, even if it's just assembling IKEA flatpacks for elderly, nursing homes, hospitals. Stuff that can be outsourced without being compromised. Reward those that work hard, do the right thing. And those that refuse get nought. No telly, just old books. Give gem not just physical skills but the change in attitude to want to keep it up when they get out. |
I like it. I feel if we can gather everyone's views and put them together we will have a better system. The trouble is this is going to be a political review and both major parties are using law and order to grab votes. |
Yeah, spot on.
I like the idea of teaching job skills, particularly if they are in a minimum security prison.
If you really want to rehabilitate people, you could look at targeted offers of Cert 3 or 4 plus practical experience to help those who commit crimes because they're trapped in the poverty cycle or have substance abuse issues or both to be able to provide for themselves legally once they're out.
those in normal or maximum security would have to earn the right with good behaviour. Rather than early parole, transfer to a minimum security prison first with access to vocational and substance abuse counselling and try to equip them so they don't just come back.
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Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Morrigu 
Joined: 11 Aug 2001
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“The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated.”
Last edited by Morrigu on Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:09 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Mugwump
Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Location: Between London and Melbourne
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| stui magpie wrote: | | Culprit wrote: | | think positive wrote: | How about a system similar to life outside? Or what it used to be before respect became obsolete.
Give all prisoners jobs, let them work their way up. Start cleaning toilets, have workshops where inmates can build furniture, even if it's just assembling IKEA flatpacks for elderly, nursing homes, hospitals. Stuff that can be outsourced without being compromised. Reward those that work hard, do the right thing. And those that refuse get nought. No telly, just old books. Give gem not just physical skills but the change in attitude to want to keep it up when they get out. |
I like it. I feel if we can gather everyone's views and put them together we will have a better system. The trouble is this is going to be a political review and both major parties are using law and order to grab votes. |
Yeah, spot on.
I like the idea of teaching job skills, particularly if they are in a minimum security prison.
If you really want to rehabilitate people, you could look at targeted offers of Cert 3 or 4 plus practical experience to help those who commit crimes because they're trapped in the poverty cycle or have substance abuse issues or both to be able to provide for themselves legally once they're out.
those in normal or maximum security would have to earn the right with good behaviour. Rather than early parole, transfer to a minimum security prison first with access to vocational and substance abuse counselling and try to equip them so they don't just come back. |
This has probably been covered before in VPT, but I did not see it : does rehabilitation happen ? If so, at what rates for what types of people after what types of crime, under what conditions etc. It always seems like a fairly faith-based idea : we must use jails to rehabilitate people, rather than for (i) just punishment of responsible individuals ; and (ii) community protection through sequestration. We presumably have lots of evidence of what works from recidivism data ....?
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Two more flags before I die! |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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Or the crims can rehabilitate the rehabilitators perhaps.... 
Parole law flaw: struck-off prison psychologist's secret marriage to Skaf gang rapist
A prison psychologist who was struck off for having a relationship with a Skaf gang rapist has married another member of the notorious child rape gang who has repeatedly hidden it from his parole officers.
Joanne Natalie Senior, 36, has changed her name to her husband's, converted to Islam and brought her husband to live with her and her parents in south-west Sydney.
One insider said the revelations are symptomatic of widespread issues within the parole industry, described as ineffective, inept and ill-equipped to supervise criminals.
"The parole officers have no clue how to manage these guys little to no training, no experience and some just don't care much," the insider said.
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/parole-law-flaw-struckoff-prison-psychologists-secret-marriage-to-skaf-gang-rapist-20170217-gufe5o.html
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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Pies4shaw 
pies4shaw
Joined: 08 Oct 2007
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| Skids wrote: | Or the crims can rehabilitate the rehabilitators perhaps....
Parole law flaw: struck-off prison psychologist's secret marriage to Skaf gang rapist
A prison psychologist who was struck off for having a relationship with a Skaf gang rapist has married another member of the notorious child rape gang who has repeatedly hidden it from his parole officers.
Joanne Natalie Senior, 36, has changed her name to her husband's, converted to Islam and brought her husband to live with her and her parents in south-west Sydney.
One insider said the revelations are symptomatic of widespread issues within the parole industry, described as ineffective, inept and ill-equipped to supervise criminals.
"The parole officers have no clue how to manage these guys little to no training, no experience and some just don't care much," the insider said.
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/parole-law-flaw-struckoff-prison-psychologists-secret-marriage-to-skaf-gang-rapist-20170217-gufe5o.html |
I'm not sure there's any reason to have this in this thread - the offender who drove through the mall was on bail, not parole. These are two very, very different things. Bail is what you get (in many cases) before you're found guilty of a crime. Parole is what you get at the other end of the process.
Apart from your general indignation about the existence of people who do bad things, what's the connection? |
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Skids
Quitting drinking will be one of the best choices you make in your life.
Joined: 11 Sep 2007
Location: Joined 3/6/02 . Member #175
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| Pies4shaw wrote: | | Skids wrote: | Or the crims can rehabilitate the rehabilitators perhaps....
Parole law flaw: struck-off prison psychologist's secret marriage to Skaf gang rapist
A prison psychologist who was struck off for having a relationship with a Skaf gang rapist has married another member of the notorious child rape gang who has repeatedly hidden it from his parole officers.
Joanne Natalie Senior, 36, has changed her name to her husband's, converted to Islam and brought her husband to live with her and her parents in south-west Sydney.
One insider said the revelations are symptomatic of widespread issues within the parole industry, described as ineffective, inept and ill-equipped to supervise criminals.
"The parole officers have no clue how to manage these guys little to no training, no experience and some just don't care much," the insider said.
http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/parole-law-flaw-struckoff-prison-psychologists-secret-marriage-to-skaf-gang-rapist-20170217-gufe5o.html |
I'm not sure there's any reason to have this in this thread - the offender who drove through the mall was on bail, not parole. These are two very, very different things. Bail is what you get (in many cases) before you're found guilty of a crime. Parole is what you get at the other end of the process.
Apart from your general indignation about the existence of people who do bad things, what's the connection? |
Nah... absolutely no connection. This was just the last convo I remembered we were discussing parole and how $%$ed the judicial system is.
Sorry if I distorted threads and threw you into another tangent man 
It drifted off topic about page 8 too champ 
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Don't count the days, make the days count. |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| He's been given life but can apply for parole in 46 years when he will be 73. Here's hoping he necks himself or another prisoner helps him neck himself. |
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David 
I dare you to try
Joined: 27 Jul 2003
Location: Andromeda
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^ I really don't think that's necessary, and it's hardly necessary to wish for it, either. If he's in jail the rest of society is safe from him, end of story.
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All watched over by machines of loving grace |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| At an estimated cost to the taxpayer of 6 million for 46 years Im hoping. |
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stui magpie
Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: In flagrante delicto
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Im genuinely surprised that people think the sentence is too lenient, compared to many of the weak sentences handed down, this strikes me as about right. 46 years before he can apply for parole if he lives that long, and no guarantee he gets released then.
Yeah it's a large cost to imprison someone for that long but with no death penalty as an option, it is what it is.
_________________
Every dead body on Mt Everest was once a highly motivated person, so maybe just calm the **** down. |
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Culprit
Joined: 06 Feb 2003
Location: Port Melbourne
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| ^^ I am surprised as well. In saying that Stui, if we stuck him into the normal prison population it would take care of itself. I am no fan of the death penalty however I would sponsor good old fashioned prison justice. |
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Wokko 
Come and take it.
Joined: 04 Oct 2005
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| I'd prefer someone had shot and killed him while he was doing it. Hell I would've settled for dragged out of the car and beaten to death. Vigilante justice is true justice. |
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