Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board Forum Index
 The RulesThe Rules FAQFAQ
   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   CalendarCalendar   SearchSearch 
Log inLog in RegisterRegister
 
Interesting Article

Users browsing this topic:0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 0 Guests
Registered Users: None

Post new topic   Reply to topic    Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board Forum Index -> General Discussion
 
Goto page 1, 2  Next
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
derkd 



Joined: 29 May 2013


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:12 pm
Post subject: Interesting ArticleReply with quote

I am not always a big Barrett fan...but he does make some good points on why 2015 is big for Collingwood and how our trade 'in's' over the past few years have been below par. I do think he fails to cut some slack on the injury factor.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-09-02/collingwoods-disappearing-act


He is right when he says....you can only pull the 'fan forum' once. Not that i am saying it was wrong to do it...but you can only do it once. If you think about it rationally ...would you be having a meeting of top brass and key stake holders (i.e members) if you were in the top four? ..what is their to discuss if things are flying along all well and good.


Last edited by derkd on Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:38 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
themonk 



Joined: 02 Mar 2004


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 8:32 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

It was a shocking year and yes we have lost several superstars since 2010, either retired or traded and furthermore the recruitment of Lynch, White & Young has offered little.

We may not be as good as what we hoped but would we have made the finals if not for our injuries, I suspect we would have. The again, would have could have......2015 is a huge year for Collingwood, in particular Nathan Buckley.

I disagree with his views on our cap though. I'd be surprised we don't have capacity to bring in one if not two big names over the next couple of years.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
slangman 



Joined: 11 Aug 2003


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 9:30 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

The article hits the nail on the head.
_________________
- Side By Side -
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message MSN Messenger  
derkd 



Joined: 29 May 2013


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:31 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

themonk wrote:
It was a shocking year and yes we have lost several superstars since 2010, either retired or traded and furthermore the recruitment of Lynch, White & Young has offered little.

We may not be as good as what we hoped but would we have made the finals if not for our injuries, I suspect we would have. The again, would have could have......2015 is a huge year for Collingwood, in particular Nathan Buckley.

I disagree with his views on our cap though. I'd be surprised we don't have capacity to bring in one if not two big names over the next couple of years.


You may well be right, and perhaps Collingwood is just playing its cards close to its chest with regards to how much cap space we have. Waiting perhaps for the rigght target to appear. I guess much is dependent on much say Swan is on.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Magpietothemax Taurus

magpietothemax


Joined: 28 Apr 2013


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:38 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Thought this was a really bad article. Really negative and took no account of the crippling injuries we confronted throughout the year. To say the year was a failure was really wrong: we saw a whole new defence emerge, with our youthful defenders Frost, Keeffe, Langdon and Williams announcing themselves as a force in the future. Their contribution this year, the way they stood firm even after the loss of their leader Maxy, was awesome.
We saw the rise of Jarrod Witts, who with Grundy will be a powerful presence in the future.
We saw the emergence of Tim Broomhead as a very talented player going forward. Jamie Elliott has arrived as a fully fledged star.
Taylor Adams has proven to be a really tough and courageous midfielder who gets the ball alot by dint of his tenacity. He has been criticised for his disposal, but this is something he can improve and become a real asset in our midfield.
In our final game, we saw the emergence of a potential tall forward : Corey Gault.
Toovey wasn't at his very best this year, but maybe he needed a year to recuperate from the ACL and the compromised pre season which he would have had while still recovering from it.
Injuries did so much damage this year. We were unable to stabilize our team and find the optimum role for each player, or even decide who was in our best 22, due to the constant merry go round of players leaving and then returning. Players were selected in the hope that they could fill a gap I created by injury, in positions with which they were not necessarily familiar.
I think this year was a baptism of fire for our young team. The judgement of this journalist, that this was a "disastrous year for Collngwood" , is entirely superficial and based purely on the finishing position on the ladder and the low attendance on the final game. This is just nonsense. With the Collingwood team decimated by so many injuries in that final game,it is not surprising that the attendance was much lower than might otherwise have been expected.
I much prefer the article written by Wayne Carey which gives almost the entirely oppostite assessment:

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/making-sense-of-collingwoods-season-in-hell-20140828-109jt4.html
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
derkd 



Joined: 29 May 2013


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:46 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Magpietothemax wrote:
Thought this was a really bad article. Really negative and took no account of the crippling injuries we confronted throughout the year. To say the year was a failure was really wrong: we saw a whole new defence emerge, with our youthful defenders Frost, Keeffe, Langdon and Williams announcing themselves as a force in the future. Their contribution this year, the way they stood firm even after the loss of their leader Maxy, was awesome.
We saw the rise of Jarrod Witts, who with Grundy will be a powerful presence in the future.
We saw the emergence of Tim Broomhead as a very talented player going forward. Jamie Elliott has arrived as a fully fledged star.
Taylor Adams has proven to be a really tough and courageous midfielder who gets the ball alot by dint of his tenacity. He has been criticised for his disposal, but this is something he can improve and become a real asset in our midfield.
In our final game, we saw the emergence of a potential tall forward : Corey Gault.
Toovey wasn't at his very best this year, but maybe he needed a year to recuperate from the ACL and the compromised pre season which he would have had while still recovering from it.
Injuries did so much damage this year. We were unable to stabilize our team and find the optimum role for each player, or even decide who was in our best 22, due to the constant merry go round of players leaving and then returning. Players were selected in the hope that they could fill a gap I created by injury, in positions with which they were not necessarily familiar.
I think this year was a baptism of fire for our young team. The judgement of this journalist, that this was a "disastrous year for Collngwood" , is entirely superficial and based purely on the finishing position on the ladder and the low attendance on the final game. This is just nonsense. With the Collingwood team decimated by so many injuries in that final game,it is not surprising that the attendance was much lower than might otherwise have been expected.
I much prefer the article written by Wayne Carey which gives almost the entirely oppostite assessment:

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/making-sense-of-collingwoods-season-in-hell-20140828-109jt4.html



And opinions are just that....i guess almost everyone on here has a diffrent take, i agree, in as much as Barrett is trying to be over sensationolist. But i thought he made a interesting point that you don't call a 'fan forum' unless you have some geniun concerns...and i think maybe the club or board are perhaps a tad more worried then they are letting on. And look anyway you shift it...that lenght of an injury list and the massive decline of attendences at matches is a concern. I agree on the player front we found some new talent this year...but like i say much of it now is about how we can use that to spring board into 2015...hence why i argue it is an important year...because at some point we have to arrest the ladder slide.


Last edited by derkd on Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Big T 



Joined: 18 Oct 2003
Location: Torino, Italy

PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:46 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

Magpietothemax wrote:
Thought this was a really bad article. Really negative and took no account of the crippling injuries we confronted throughout the year. To say the year was a failure was really wrong: we saw a whole new defence emerge, with our youthful defenders Frost, Keeffe, Langdon and Williams announcing themselves as a force in the future. Their contribution this year, the way they stood firm even after the loss of their leader Maxy, was awesome.
We saw the rise of Jarrod Witts, who with Grundy will be a powerful presence in the future.
We saw the emergence of Tim Broomhead as a very talented player going forward. Jamie Elliott has arrived as a fully fledged star.
Taylor Adams has proven to be a really tough and courageous midfielder who gets the ball alot by dint of his tenacity. He has been criticised for his disposal, but this is something he can improve and become a real asset in our midfield.
In our final game, we saw the emergence of a potential tall forward : Corey Gault.
Toovey wasn't at his very best this year, but maybe he needed a year to recuperate from the ACL and the compromised pre season which he would have had while still recovering from it.
Injuries did so much damage this year. We were unable to stabilize our team and find the optimum role for each player, or even decide who was in our best 22, due to the constant merry go round of players leaving and then returning. Players were selected in the hope that they could fill a gap I created by injury, in positions with which they were not necessarily familiar.
I think this year was a baptism of fire for our young team. The judgement of this journalist, that this was a "disastrous year for Collngwood" , is entirely superficial and based purely on the finishing position on the ladder and the low attendance on the final game. This is just nonsense. With the Collingwood team decimated by so many injuries in that final game,it is not surprising that the attendance was much lower than might otherwise have been expected.
I much prefer the article written by Wayne Carey which gives almost the entirely oppostite assessment:

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/making-sense-of-collingwoods-season-in-hell-20140828-109jt4.html


while U make some valid points, every club can claim similar improvements and glimmers of hope from young players.

2014 was a massive fail against pert and eds expectations, that cannot and shouldnot be denied, and that includes the performance of fitness and conditioning gurus who remain no closer to the answer.

_________________
Buon Giorno
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Magpietothemax Taurus

magpietothemax


Joined: 28 Apr 2013


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:14 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that the carnage from injuries is a terrible concern which must be resolved. Over the next few weeks/months, we must find the solution to this. And I have no doubt that a solution will be found, because no other club had an injury rate like Collingwood's this year. Therefore, a clear, scientific reason for it must exist and I have faith that the necessary specialists will be called in to ascertain the causes and remedy them.
I think that the terrible rate of injuries was a major driving force behind our disappointing form in the second half of the season. Not just because stars were missing, but because of the consequent instability of our team, the exhaustion of young players forced to take on too much responsibility, and growing lack of confidence which made it more and more difficult to play well. All other clubs can claim to see glimmering of hope from young players, but there was no other team this year that threw so many of their young players into battle for such an extended series of games as Collingwood. Our young players have matured at an accelerated rate compared with other teams due to dire necessity imposed by our injury list.
I think that the decline in ladder position will be arrested just through the process of rectifying our training program.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
watt price tully Scorpio



Joined: 15 May 2007


PostPosted: Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:19 pm
Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought the article was pretty good & accurate in overall terms but as has been mentioned the article didn't place enough weight on the injuries sustained & the inexperience of our team.
_________________
“I even went as far as becoming a Southern Baptist until I realised they didn’t keep ‘em under long enough” Kinky Friedman
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Redlight 



Joined: 11 Jun 2009


PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:08 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

It's written in typical Barrett style, all furrowed brow, fake concern and doom-mongering but offering no insight or analysis.

That entire article to simply say 'Collingwood had a poor year, it would be bad if it happened again'.

Wow, thanks Sherlock.

Also what's this 'so many players fell to injury for a second consecutive year'? We've had three solid years of disastrous injuries, Luke Ball, McCaffer, Krakeour and Keefe all did their knees in 2012 on top of serious soft-tissue injuries to guys like Ben Johnson and Didak (there were plenty of others too).

It's easily the worst THREE years of injuries that I can remember at any club. All of the time that Bucks has been head coach has been cruelled by this incredible run of major injuries, many of them to key players.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
swoop42 Virgo

Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?


Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18

PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:39 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

We've played some uninspiring and flawed football a lot of the time the last two seasons since Bucks put his stamp on the game plan and many of the problems of this season were identified last year yet they still remain.

Ken Hinkley has ruined it for all rookie coaches from here on out as he's shown that you can take a club considered a basket case and turn it around in a single season so no more excuses for Buckley in 2015.

We either improve markedly and the future is looking bright once again or we go further backwards and his time is up I'm afraid.

Bucks#noexcuses2015

_________________
He's mad. He's bad. He's MaynHARD!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Redlight 



Joined: 11 Jun 2009


PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:26 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

swoop42 wrote:
We've played some uninspiring and flawed football a lot of the time the last two seasons since Bucks put his stamp on the game plan and many of the problems of this season were identified last year yet they still remain.

Ken Hinkley has ruined it for all rookie coaches from here on out as he's shown that you can take a club considered a basket case and turn it around in a single season so no more excuses for Buckley in 2015.

We either improve markedly and the future is looking bright once again or we go further backwards and his time is up I'm afraid.

Bucks#noexcuses2015


You can't ignore the injuries, why would anyone even think that we should?

I'm also perplexed at the Richmond-like belief that ditching the coach is a surefire fix. Ken Hinkley's run (which has brought no flags as far as I can tell) is very much the exception and is not guaranteed to continue. In the second half of the year they've been less than stellar.

Consider this list...

Scott Watters
James Hird
Michael Voss
Mark Neeld
Brett Ratten
Matthew Primus
Mark Harvey
Rodney Eade
Dean Bailey
Neil Craig

All of these were hired in good faith to replace coaches perceived to have failed or who had left of their own accord. They were to correct the mistakes of the past and take their clubs forward.

All are failed/disgraced and gone. And the clubs they came to save lose years every time they panic and sack the coach.

Let's face it, Hardwick may well have been on that list if he hadn't regained some key personnel from injury, he's no better a coach now than he was when Richmond was 3 and 10.

Let's not forget how much pressure Bomber Thompson was under in 2006...

Quote:
"I think there were a few areas they wanted answers for to clarify whether they were going to support Mark Thompson as coach or not in 2007," Thompson said. "They were pretty difficult questions and I answered them as honestly as I could then I walked away, walked out of the meeting, left.


Geelong was wise enough to examine the situation and brave enough to stay the course, I'm sure there were plenty of supporters calling for his head.

There's a lot of smart football people at Collingwood. If Buckley couldn't coach it would've been very apparent very early. If he can't coach then the club has been lying to us for three years knowing, with certainty, that the truth would be exposed eventually. Does that sound realistic?

Obviously those in the know think the man has what it takes. If that's the case then it's insane to sack a man you believe in for the sake of appeasing the impatient, reckless and uninformed.

I can only hope that the decision makers are less like the Richmond of the last, well forever, and more like the Geelong of 2006.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
swoop42 Virgo

Whatcha gonna do when he comes for you?


Joined: 02 Aug 2008
Location: The 18

PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:51 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you even open to the possibility that Buckley might end up belonging on that list you provided and needs replacing at the end of the next year if we perform worse than this season?

He didn't inherit a basket case like a Neeld or Watters and as we've seen with Port and Fremantle a teams fortunes can be turned around very quickly with the right coach with essentially the same list as the previous incumbent.

_________________
He's mad. He's bad. He's MaynHARD!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Redlight 



Joined: 11 Jun 2009


PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:43 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

swoop42 wrote:
Are you even open to the possibility that Buckley might end up belonging on that list you provided and needs replacing at the end of the next year if we perform worse than this season?

He didn't inherit a basket case like a Neeld or Watters and as we've seen with Port and Fremantle a teams fortunes can be turned around very quickly with the right coach with essentially the same list as the previous incumbent.


If we get to the end of next year, with a decent run with injuries and our best players available, to find that we're in a worse position than this year? Then absolutely.

If that was the case I think the club will act without any of us having to say a thing.

I suspect, if that's the case, that the club will act without any of us having to say a thing.
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
The Boy Who Cried Wolf 



Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Location: We prefer free speech - you know it's right

PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 6:18 am
Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd already read Wayne's article and frankly thought it was rubbish, Barrett's imho is much closer to the mark - he does acknowledge our injuries, but in it he also acknowledge the plain facts which some of our die hard fans fail to either recognise, or accept.
_________________
All Aboard!! Choo Choo!!!
Back to top  
View user's profile Send private message  
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Nick's Collingwood Bulletin Board Forum Index -> General Discussion All times are GMT + 11 Hours

Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2   

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum



Privacy Policy

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group